Kosminski and Victim DNA Match on Shawl

[lynn cates]

coherent

Hello Amanda. Thanks.

Can't disagree. Still looking for some coherent story.

Cheers.
LC

[lynn cates]

K

Hello Ghost. Welcome to the boards.

Just to be clear, Kosminski was not identified by a policeman and he was not a suspect in 1888--so far as we have any record.

If there is blood spatter on the table runner, then it behooves one to explain how her clothes escaped that. It is also needful to explain why the shawl is not listed amongst the effects, and how Simpson obtained it.

"In isolation, the physics/math are not 100 percent certain. But when you look at the totality and start to apply Occam's Razor, it's really intriguing evidence."

Ockham's razor? Well, that states that "Entia non multiplicanda sunt--sine necessitate." What entity is being multiplied here? Kate's belongings, perhaps?

Cheers.
LC

[Varqm]

Just a hunch ,if the conclusions (for ex.,it comes down to a handful of people matching
the profiles from the shawl) from the tests were based on the precise/thorough
procedures necessary to make it solid ,they would have published everything about the tests one
way or another.It would gave their conclusions more integrity.But because it's iffy, they sell books first
then worry about the peer review later.It's related to the "let's sell Jack the Ripper eraser/pencil"
logic.

When the peer review comes,my hunch is that the tests won't prove - based on the match -
the profiles in the shawl came from Catherine/Aaron and her/his immediate family at that time.
Or even that it belonged to a family they know of,they're relationship only being
having a common ancestor from generations back,rare subclade or not.

Until the peer review comes ...more power to Edwards. I hope he makes as much money as he can. This is a "commercial world'.

[Jeff Leahy]

I see the objections I raise, as usual, are not dealt with by the pro-Kosminskites, but then hiow they could be--not without the theory collapsing.

He wasn't dead and the Chief Constable new this.

I am hardly the first to argue that the Kosminski-as-Ripper theory defies commone sense.

I just don't get this all the psychratric evidence, And yes I can't spell, says other wise…

Araon Kosminski mental state does not dismiss him from being abe to commit the Jack the Ripper crimes….its that simple and I'm happy to discuss that in detail as its my area

Yours Jeff

[pinkmoon]

Lived in the area ,Looney,picked up knife two years after murders so he became a suspect because when you have no suspect any potential suspect will look good it's called desperation.If such a good suspect why did sir Melville choose poor Druitt over him.

[Jeff Leahy]

General Information for Posters:

1. The Personal Attack policy is in place and will be enforced on this thread. Do not attack other posters. Even if they totally deserve it and even if they started it. You will receive an infraction. Just like they will, until everyone is banned and peace reigns and the Admin can go drink margaritas on a nice beach in Aruba.

2. If you cannot discuss the adult content of this case without resorting to sophomoric terminology such as wanking, jizz. boner, etc, don't post about these issues.

If your mommy never taught you the grown-up words for things, now is a good time to go and enrich your vocabulary so that you can have a mature conversation.

Dehumanizing the victims and the crimes committed against them with juvenile terminology will not be tolerated on this board.

THis thread is becoming difficult to follow due to its size… I almost missed this post..

I'm not trying to criticise but perhaps you might consider an update to site?… Perhaps posts could be considered like traffic lights wherer posters making factual comets could be considered GREEN and simply making comment Red?

That way we could hopefully flick through large threads more quickly socking up the important bits…Hopefully posters would learn to Self regulate…just an idea Admin

Yours Jeff

[Bridewell]

What ever we think about the Diary, Its has held up for twenty odd years and still unproven to be fake.

But also unproven to be genuine - and it is the positive which must be proven. One consolation in all this is that, if the shawl theory is proven valid, the Maybrick Diary becomes firelighters.

[Jeff Leahy]

As I explained above, that would indicate holding up the chin with one hand while cutting her throat with the other. One-handed strangulation doesn't usually work.

Ah right this is your pet theory? Possibly but unlikely..

But, as I said, if the cloth were a fetish object, I find it odd that it would be found to carry only Eddowes' DNA, and none of the other victims. And archeology is chock full of speculation. Like in criminology, it is a helpful tool but one must guard against taking it too far.

I think you'll find people were speculating…The shawl could have been many things…the science suggests it was at the murder scene.. hence the speculation…

Might be worth getting your tooth brush the correct way around…bloody amateurs

Boys, boys, don't you have videos and books to sell, just like Edwards? I don't begrudge you having a financial interest in your pet hypotheses, but it does call your open-mindedness into question.

Hey, I recognize those names! Could this field of study get more incestuous?

O grow up for christ sake

[Semper_Eadem]

You know even with out the shawl and DNA Kosminski is a pretty decent suspect. I thought most Ripperologists would be pleased that suspicion has re-centered on Kosminski, this is not like Maybrick or the Royal Conspiracy theories where we ended up with suspects out of the blue like Maybrick, Prince Albert Victor and Walter Sickert.

[Bridewell]

And I have also read the newly-anointed Donald Swanson and his holy scripture.

Simon, are you saying that the Swanson Marginalia are suspect or that Donald Sutherland Swanson didn't know what he was talking about? I know MacNaghten didn't enter the scene until 1889, but I can't seen any reason to suppose that Kosminski was a name he plucked from thin air. Kosminski must have been, at or around the material time, a police suspect.

[Monty]

Now that cricket season is over, we might get some work out of the ol' boy.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

After last nights traditional end of season booze up, this week is a non-runner.

Monty

[Semper_Eadem]

I thought Swanson was just writing those notes for himself? Really, I think we are lucky to be able to see it. With out the marginalia we would never have known about Kosminski.

[Boris Godunov]

But also unproven to be genuine - and it is the positive which must be proven. One consolation in all this is that, if the shawl theory is proven valid, the Maybrick Diary becomes firelighters.

Er, didn't the fellow who first came forward with the Maybrick Diary eventually state it was a deliberate hoax? I suppose that doesn't prove it's not genuine, but it certainly makes its viability as genuine so suspect as to be not worth serious consideration. It's so suspect that I'm frankly surprised anyone still takes it seriously.

As for Kosminski (and I yes, I'm a newbie chiming in late in this thread), it seems to me he's still as viable as any other named suspect. Certainly his name being singled out by two different men involved in the investigation is worth high consideration. I'm very suspicious of the purported DNA evidence (the questionable origin of the shawl IS a problem, no way around it), but it could be a case of "Right Suspect, Wrong Evidence."

The Swanson marginalia is pretty eyebrow-raising, in my view. Unless one suggests that Swanson is lying or the note was written by someone else as a hoax, then it positively validates the instance of someone being taken to the seaside safe house, and that same someone being identified by a witness as the man he saw with Eddowes right before she was murdered. It's a pretty amazing story, and one not well-known at all outside of dedicated Ripper enthusiasts.

Back in the 1980s there was a television special episode hosted by Sir Peter Ustinov in which a panel of experts was assembled to review the prominent named Ripper suspects and conclude the most likely culprit. The panel included a forensic pathologist, a prosecutor, two FBI special agents and Michael Fido. The panel's conclusion was unanimous: Kosminski was the most likely killer. However, one of the FBI agents said something I think is quite apt:

"If it wasn't Kosminski, then it was someone just like him."

Cheers!

[Semper_Eadem]

Hello Boris, I saw The Secret Identity Of Jack The Ripper again on Youtube recently, which was hosted by Peter Ustinov. I remember seeing it back in 1988. It certainly enforced my view of David Cohen as JTR at the time.

[Bridewell]

Hi Paul

I gather that you have had a tough year and been most unwell at times.

I'd just like to say how wonderful it is to have you back sounding so well, so informed and as brilliant a ripperolist as has ever existed.

The boards sparkle when your posts appear.

Great to have you back

Yours Jeff

Can I take the opportunity to second that - and to say that I have just got hold of a copy of "Jack the Ripper - The Facts" which I am greatly looking forward to. Welcome back, Paul.