New Article on Kozminski in Ripperologist 128

[robhouse]

And this:

The Wilds of London, by James Greenwood, 1874 - Preface - A Visit to "Tiger Bay"

http://www.victorianlondon.org/publi...s3/wilds-1.htm

Seems to me that Brunswick Street was a street full of brothels... which is pretty interesting. You remember that thing we were talking about Chris?

Rob H

[robhouse]

Interesting also to point out (again to Chris)... "Tiger Bay" was originally the name given to the docklands area of Cardiff. So you are coming full circle here... one Tiger Bay to another.

Rob

[Mr Lucky]

Odd that the article states "Jack is their prey chiefly."... not entirely certain what is meant by Jack, but it seems to me that it perhaps has the same meaning as what we in the US call a "john" or in the UK a "punter."

Hi Rob

It may mean 'Jack Tar' or a sailor in other words.

[robhouse]

That sounds reasonable.

[robhouse]

Here are a couple interesting excerpts from Booth's Police notebooks "Walk with Inspector Reid, 10 March 1898."

One page describes Providence Place—I assume this is Providence Street(?)—and the other describes Brunswick St.

Providence Place: "2 st. better north end than S, mess, head, tims, orange peel, purple on map, into Berner St, children just coming out of Bd. School, Jewish type all fairly dressed some very well dressed, all clean, well fed, large majority with hats, girls & boys. under gateway on S.E. side took place one of the 'Ripper' murders..."

Brunswick St: 2 st, Jews, costers going around selling fresh water fish (illegible) & beetroot! (??)

RH

[robhouse]

I have a small (difficult to read) version of Booth's map of "Jewish East London" and from what I can tell, both Providence St and Brunswick St are about 90-100% jewish.

I could be wrong... it seems Providence Street is. Brunswick St is possibly slightly lower in places (75-90%).

RH

[Chris]

Here are a couple interesting excerpts from Booth's Police notebooks "Walk with Inspector Reid, 10 March 1898."

One page describes Providence Place—I assume this is Providence Street(?)—and the other describes Brunswick St.

Providence Place: "2 st. better north end than S, mess, head, tims, orange peel, purple on map, into Berner St, children just coming out of Bd. School, Jewish type all fairly dressed some very well dressed, all clean, well fed, large majority with hats, girls & boys. under gateway on S.E. side took place one of the 'Ripper' murders..."

Brunswick St: 2 st, Jews, costers going around selling fresh water fish (illegible) & beetroot! (??)

Thanks. Those descriptions are interesting. Regarding the "mess" in Providence Place, I'm not sure about the word before "orange" (maybe "tins"?), but I think the first word is "bread" - the kind of food that might be picked up from the gutters by someone suffering from paranoia.

This ties in with the description of Mile End Old Town in another of the police notebooks:
"Great mess in Jewish streets - fishes heads - paper of all colours - bread (not a great deal of this) - orange peel in abundance."
http://booth.lse.ac.uk/notebooks/b351/jpg/49.html

And yes, all roads lead back to Tiger Bay ...

[Robert]

I think the fish were dace and roach.

I'm having trouble with Paint at the moment, but there was a sailor-robbing case in Lloyd's, Dec 29th 1861 page 4, which mentions a den in "Everard-street, part of Tiger-bay, St. George's-in-the-East." This was of course some years before the Ripper murder.

[robhouse]

It seems to me, from what Tom posted, that the area of Brunswick St and surrounding was "formerly" referred to as Tiger Bay, but perhaps not in the late 1880s.

RH

[Robert]

Finally worked out how to do it.

[robhouse]

Hi Robert,

This seems to suggest that the whole area there bordered by Christian Street, Pinchin Street, Backchurch Lane and Fairclough Street may have been referred to as Tiger Bay... at least in the 1860s and 1870s.

Rob H

[Paddy]

All the talk of Tiger Bay makes me wonder why (If Aaron could have been JTR) was he drawn to Whitechapel and not south to the docks?
Its something I have thought about often.
There were more Jewish people living in Whitechapel so he might blend in more as opposed Tiger Bay ?.....Or did he have connections in Whitechapel?

Pat Marshall

[robhouse]

Hi Pat,

I get the sense (and I could be wrong) that the area around Brunswick Street was referred to as "Tiger Bay" in the 1860s and 1870, but perhaps that the influx of Jews into that area in the 1880s might have pushed the prostitution out of that area to an extent. It has always seemed to me that the majority of the "street" prostitutes were around the area of Spitalfields... i.e. north of Whitechapel High Street, and that the area south of that thoroughfare was comparatively less of a prostitute area. Tiger Bay, perhaps, was an exception to this...

From Booth's 1899 map of Jews in the East End, the area referred to as Tiger bay looks primarily Jewish. I assume there was also a high percetage of Jews there in 1888... and this is supported by Booth's writings. Brunswick Street, for example, is described as "2 st [2 story houses], Jews."

It is known that Jewish women participated in prostitution, although I believe that they did not work the streets so much but worked mainly indoors, in Jewish brothels. I have never found anything that indicates where these Jewish brothels were, but I would say that the "Tiger Bay" area is a good bet. If this surmise is indeed correct, then it may have been that Aaron lived in the middle of an area with a lot of Jewish brothels (I am speculating here)... still he would have had to go north to seek out the "street" prostitutes, since they were more accessible victims. The area to the south of Pinchin Street was more or less the docks area, and I believe there was a good share of prostitution there as well, but it was not so much of a Jewish area.

It is not so easy to answer your question.

Again, I commend your great work in Kozminski research.

Rob House

[Robert]

Hi Rob

Perhaps the scope of the term narrowed as time passed. i suppose the best sources would be those close to 1888, although an older person, born in the area, might still use the term in its older sense.

[Stephen Thomas]

Perhaps the scope of the term narrowed as time passed. i suppose the best sources would be those close to 1888, although an older person, born in the area, might still use the term in its older sense.

Hi Robert

The only Tiger Bay in London at that time was down by the docks off Ratcliff Highway in St George in the East as the article you posted states. Oscar Wilde in 'Dorian Gray' referred to the area as Bluegate Fields. There were a couple of opium dens there. It was the closest red light district to the London docks where sailors could be relieved of their wages and has nothing to do with Spitalfields. The area was pretty much totally demolished in the 1890s.