discussion of Aaron Kosminski's psychological profile

[robhouse]

Perhaps the question should be, and I hope I'm not hijacking the thread, is it likely or even possible that JTR was a schizophrenic? My own view is that it's very unlikely but I do know that schizophrenics have periods of lucidity. Maybe Koz performed these evil acts when in a more clear thinking time frame. Maybe a psychopath and schizophrenic existed in the same mind? Again, I think this exceedingly unlikely but it can make for an interesting discussion.

Hi Greg,

This is obviously a very important question. To start, I think your point about the coexistence of psychopathy and schizophrenia (ie. psychosis) is very likely. The more I read about this, it seems that violent schizophrenic serial killers are more likely to be motivated to violence by a combination of the two than by positive schizophrenic symptoms alone (ie. command hallucinations, orders to kill etc.)

The more I read about schizophrenic serial killers, the more likely it seems to me that JTR may have been in this category. So I am talking about people like Robert Napper, Herbert Mullin, Tsutomu Miyazaki, Richard Chase, Ottis Toole, Hadden Clark, Marc Sappington, James Clayton Lawson. The common denominator of all these serial killers is that they did post-mortem mutilation on the victims, and would be classified as "lust murderers." They take organs from the victims, and target their mutilation at the sexual organs and breasts, they eviscerate the victims, they engage in cannibalism. So, yes... there is a great similarity between schizophrenic serial killers, and what is known about Jack the Ripper. Robert Napper is, perhaps, one of the best direct parallels, and his murder of Samantha Bissett is said to have had a striking similarity to the Mary Kelly murder and mutilation (as just one example).

Rob H

[JtRMordke]

That is very possible! I like your idea on that since it links in with what the rest of the sentence implies!

And on to your question - an obvious comparison would be with the Yorkshire Ripper who was also apparently suffering from schizophrenia. I know there is the assumption that schizophrenics are not dangerous, and under normal conditions they are not, but if Aaron had access to alcohol then it could have made his condition a lot worse, and we do not know in enough detail what the voices in his head were telling him. Plus, from what I know of the illness, it comes in bursts. I agree that whatever happened, he would have had some days where he was a bit more 'out of it' than others. But since I do not personally know any people with schizophrenia, I have very limited knowledge on the mental illness.

[Chris]

I think the point is that he drank it direct from the tap so that no one could tamper with it - for the same reason that he refused food at the hands of others.

[GregBaron]

Possible Schizophrenic?

Roberts point about the tap is amusing but perhaps they meant he slurped from the tap rather than filling a glass or something. I'm sure everyone in the East end had impeccable manners right! Anyway, this Kosminski mental conditon thing has been whacked around(pun intended) in the past.
Perhaps the question should be, and I hope I'm not hijacking the thread, is it likely or even possible that JTR was a schizophrenic? My own view is that it's very unlikely but I do know that schizophrenics have periods of lucidity. Maybe Koz performed these evil acts when in a more clear thinking time frame. Maybe a psychopath and schizophrenic existed in the same mind? Again, I think this exceedingly unlikely but it can make for an interesting discussion.




Greg

[JtRMordke]

I don't think they would have mentioned it unless there was something significantly odd about it - but I believe they may have been referring to one of the outside taps that contained dirty water (not that the water quality would have been great anyway) which I think I have seen in some of the old Whitechapel photographs. Perhaps it was one of those communal outside taps that they are talking about Aaron drinking out of. This is only an assumption so correct me if I'm wrong.

[Robert]

I know I am being dense here, but in those days and in that area, where else could Aaron have got water, except from the tap?

[JtRMordke]

Hmmm... that appears strange too. I believe this must have been a human error since the whole sentence is cut out, however it is a slight concern if the cut down version was included in the new version of the A-Z. Was it included in the older copy? I cannot recall this as I borrowed it from the library a few months ago.

[Chris]

It is a bit odd that Begg left this out. I assume it was just a simple error(?)

I assume so, but unfortunately it has propagated through several publications, including the new "A to Z." Sugden did include the missing sentences, though.

[Natalie Severn]

Yes,thanks Chris.That explains.It is a bit odd that Rob,I agree.

[robhouse]

It is a bit odd that Begg left this out. I assume it was just a simple error(?)

[Chris]

The other comments which follow refer to what Jacob Cohen said about Aaron Kosminski viz
Jacob Cohen,51 Carter Lane,St Paul"s EC says he goes about the streets and picksup his bits of bread out of the gutter and eats them,he drinks water from the tap and refuses foos at the hands of others.He took up a knife and threatened the life of his sister.He is very dirty and will not be washed.He has not attempted any kind of work for years.

There is no mention in either statement about masturbation or "self abuse".

The problem is that some of these published versions of Cohen's statement are incomplete. The original records do include a reference to self-abuse.

This is the statement as it appears in LMA StBG/ME/107/8, no 1558 (Orders for reception of lunatics into asylums, 1889-1891):
(b) Facts communicated by others, viz.:-
Jacob Cohen 51 Carter Lane St Pauls, City of London says that he goes about the streets and picks up bits of bread out of the gutter & eats them, he drinks water from the tap & he refuses food at the hands of others. He took up a knife & threatened the life of his sister. He says that he is ill and his cure consists in refusing food. He is melancholic, practises self-abuse. He is very dirty and will not be washed. He has not attempted any kind of work for years.

And this is the statement as it appears in LMA H12/CH/B13/39 (Colney Hatch Case Book Male Side new series no 20):
2. Other facts indicating Insanity communicated to him by others
Jacob Cohen, 51, Carter Lane, St Paul's, E.C. says that he goes about the streets and picks up bits of bread out of the gutter, and eats them, he drinks water from the tap & he refuses food at the hands of others. He took up a knife and threatened the life of his Sister. He says that he is ill and his cure consists in refusing food. He is melancholic, practises self-abuse. He is very dirty and will not be washed. He has not attempted any kind of work for years.

[Natalie Severn]

I am referring to the additional information provided by the certifying medical officer, EK Houchin, in which he provides a synopsis of Kosminski"s symptoms as expressed by Kosminski to him ,presumably during an initial assessment . Houchin interprets or accepts Kosminski"s symptoms as stemming from auditory hallucinations viz
Houchin: " He declares that he is guided and his movements altogether controlled by an instinct that informs his mind,he says that he knows the movements of all mankind,he refuses food from others because he is told to do so,and he eats out of gutters for the same reason.

The other comments which follow refer to what Jacob Cohen said about Aaron Kosminski viz
Jacob Cohen,51 Carter Lane,St Paul"s EC says he goes about the streets and picksup his bits of bread out of the gutter and eats them,he drinks water from the tap and refuses foos at the hands of others.He took up a knife and threatened the life of his sister.He is very dirty and will not be washed.He has not attempted any kind of work for years.

There is no mention in either statement about masturbation or "self abuse".
His notes refer to it but only in the sense that his family have reported it.
The notes give "background information" supplied by his family.
From "JtR The Definitive History" by Paul Begg.

[Chris]

Because the doctor's diagnosis refer specifically to his delusions and hallucinations.Others here have mentioned satyriasis,based on the family"s reports about his masturbation.Clearly the doctors made no such suggestion that there were any sexual symptoms that were particularly worthy of inclusion either in their diagnosis or later notes on Kosminski.

No, that's just not true. It was among the "facts ... communicated to him by others" on which Dr Houchin based his conclusion that Aaron Kozminski was insane. If he had not thought it "worthy of inclusion," obviously he wouldn't have included it! And it was later singled out by someone - we don't know who or why - as the "supposed cause" of Aaron's insanity.

I have no idea why you find it so important to try to deny this, but it's there in the records in black and white.

[Natalie Severn]

I really don't understand why you're making such a big deal out of this, but the fact is that Jacob Cohen's statement about self-abuse is included in the list of symptoms on which Dr Houchin founded his conclusion that Aaron Kozminski was insane, under the heading "Facts communicated by others." Obviously someone later singled this as the supposed cause of insanity - we don't know who did that or on what basis. You're correct in saying it's not otherwise mentioned in the surviving records.

Because the doctor's diagnosis refer specifically to his delusions and hallucinations.Others here have mentioned satyriasis,based on the family"s reports about his masturbation.Clearly the doctors made no such suggestion that there were any sexual symptoms that were particularly worthy of inclusion either in their diagnosis or later notes on Kosminski.

[Chris]

Just to recap: Kosminski"s doctors did not refer to masturbation in the summary of symptoms for his diagnosis.

I really don't understand why you're making such a big deal out of this, but the fact is that Jacob Cohen's statement about self-abuse is included in the list of symptoms on which Dr Houchin founded his conclusion that Aaron Kozminski was insane, under the heading "Facts communicated by others." Obviously someone later singled this as the supposed cause of insanity - we don't know who did that or on what basis. You're correct in saying it's not otherwise mentioned in the surviving records.