My theory on Kosminski

[Elamarna]

Hi Pat,
While the evidence of the connection between Cohen and Kosminski appears strong, I am not 100% convinced, maybe 90%.
it seems something occurred to the family in early October 88, thus the withdrawal from school

Steve

[Paddy]

Woolf took his daughter rebecca out of Berner street school on 11.Oct.1888 address 25 Providence street.

She was out of school for 7 months and then when she went to her next school her address was now 34 Yalford street and her date of birth was altered to allow for these 7 months out of school. It was later changed back and a comment made about 6 months other school ?

Woolf and Betsy were in Yalford street in March 1889 when she lost her baby.

These are the records of Rebecca from Ancestry school admissions attached

Pat.....

[Paddy]

Thanks Karsten

I composed Ripperologist 128 article with Chris Phillips.
Chris had a great deal of knowledge of the Abrahams family and I hope he does not mind my saying that he was pretty sure too when we wrote the paper.

Jacob Cohen (son of Kasriel) was the brother of Brucha/Betsy Kozminski. It is also highly likely he is the Jacob who committed his cousin Aaron.

When he said "Aaron attacked his sister" as it was written third hand it could have meant Aarons sister or Jacobs sister. I do think it is likely that it was Jacobs sister (Woolfs wife) who was attacked, hence her brothers involvement.
As I said, if it was Matilda (Aarons other sister) I would have thought that her husband Morris would have been involved ?

Wolek Lajb Kozminski ( son of Abram Josif and Golda) married Brucha Kozminski in Klodawa in 1881 And Bruchas father was Kasriel Szlama and mother Ryfka. from Poland, Jewish Records Indexing-Poland, Marriages, 1798-1939

Woolf and Betsy and children moved to Bury New Road, Cheetham, Manchester by 1901 census Cheetham was where Jacob had lived for many years before he went to South Africa. .

Pat......

[S.Brett]

A few years ago there was an article by Patricia Marshall and Chris Phillips in Ripperologist: "Who was Jacob Cohen?". If I remember correctly, the parents of Woolf Abrahamīs wife Betsy Abrahams were Kasriel Szlama Kozminski and Ryfka, nee Lachman. They had a son, Jacob Kozminski, later Jacob Cohen, butcher in Manchester. Probably the same Jacob Cohen of the company (Jacob) Cohen/(Thomas Coughtrey) Davies/ (Woolf) Abrahams (Aaron Kozminskiīs brother). The dog incident/ Aaron Kozminski in December 1889 in Cheapside (not far from the address of this London-company in 51 Carter Lane): Aaron Kozminski said that "the dog belongs to Jacobs", maybe he wanted to say the dog belongs to Jacob Cohen. The name of the whole article was "New light on Aaron Kozminski", better I read it again.

[Elamarna]

Jacob Cohen was Betsy's brother? And he had Aaron thrown out of the house? I must be really out to lunch, because both of those facts are news to me.

John,
I think you will find the first is a relatively new suggestion, not entirely without support, it depends on ones reading of the account, however it is not established as far as i am aware, that she was the woman married to wolf or that cohen was his brother in law. it does however offer interesting options.

The second i fear is an unsupported extension of the first idea.
if Scott has actual evidence to support it, then i of course appologise, i just have not seen any myself.

steve

[John Malcolm]

Jacob Cohen was Betsy's brother? And he had Aaron thrown out of the house? I must be really out to lunch, because both of those facts are news to me.

[Scott Nelson]

Yes, it was the brother's brother-in-law that got him first thrown out of the house and then confined in the asylum.

[S.Brett]

Hi Pat!

It seems to me that when Jacob Cohen took Aaron Kozminski to the Infirmary and declared he thought him to be insane because he attacked his sister, he was talking about his own sister Betsy who was married to Aarons brother Woolf.
Had it been the sister Matilda who was attacked surely Morris would have been involved, in case information was needed.

I think its possible that as Aaron started to get ill he was evicted from living with Woolf and Betsy. Betsy seems to have just got pregnant for the child that she lost in February 1889. I am not sure how many months pregnant she was though, if anybody can help?

Is it possible there is a connection with his mutilations and Betsys prgnancy.
If he blamed her for being thrown out? Oh and also that he was not well mentally?

Pat.....

Interesting considerations.

Greetings, Karsten.

[Paddy]

It seems to me that when Jacob Cohen took Aaron Kozminski to the Infirmary and declared he thought him to be insane because he attacked his sister, he was talking about his own sister Betsy who was married to Aarons brother Woolf.
Had it been the sister Matilda who was attacked surely Morris would have been involved, in case information was needed.

I think its possible that as Aaron started to get ill he was evicted from living with Woolf and Betsy. Betsy seems to have just got pregnant for the child that she lost in February 1889. I am not sure how many months pregnant she was though, if anybody can help?

Is it possible there is a connection with his mutilations and Betsys prgnancy.
If he blamed her for being thrown out? Oh and also that he was not well mentally?

Pat.....

[John Wheat]

You beat me to it John. Kosminski was named as a suspect in a contemporary police report unlike Bury and a whole host of other suspects. I'd tend to take notice of the police officers who were around at the time over some of the characters who contribute to this forum

Why they didn't come near to solving the case?

[Varqm]

a few days ago he took up a chair and attempted to strike the charge attendant...

Threatening his sister with a knife?

---

Be real, people who did one of the above or both are murderers?
Surely you've read or seen a lot ,much worse, but were not.

[Scott Nelson]

Exactly as there is no detailed recording of the incident we don't know how serious Kosminski was in this threat. I still think he's a poor suspect.

Yes, he's a poor suspect (the former hairdresser Aaron Abrahams Kosminski).
Assumptions..assumptions...assumptions...

...and Bury murdered for money.. assumptions...

[Wickerman]

From the Colney Hatch notes: 1892 Jan 9...at times excited and violent- a few days ago he took up a chair and attempted to strike the charge attendant; That's evidence.

But the same question arises, was Kozminski defending himself (in his eyes), or was he attacking the attendant?
Holding a chair up is a typical defensive posture, telling someone to get back, stay away from me.
Kozminski was paranoid, from what we read.

[Observer]

You beat me to it John. Kosminski was named as a suspect in a contemporary police report unlike Bury and a whole host of other suspects. I'd tend to take notice of the police officers who were around at the time over some of the characters who contribute to this forum

[John Malcolm]

From the Colney Hatch notes: 1892 Jan 9...at times excited and violent- a few days ago he took up a chair and attempted to strike the charge attendant; That's evidence.