Evidence to prove a suspect valid

[lynn cates]

power of a woman

Hello Jason. Thanks.

Very enterprising for a lady who had spent several hours in gaol and who had been incapacitated.

Cheers.
LC

[Tom_Wescott]

Post hoc ergo propter hoc.

Gesundheit.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

[GUT]

G'Day all

I've seen it asked before but never answered, figures for 87 88 89 quoted but can anyone tell me just how many of those knife killings involved slashed throats?

I Can't find it anywhere, but don't have access to many of the records those of you "on the ground" do.

Thanks all

GUT

[Errata]

Hmmm, the 'suggestion' comes from a whole lot more than that, Errata, and 'there can't possibly be two killers' is nonsense, since nobody has ever had Jack down for every single case of murder that year. The suggestion that Jack may have gone on to find Eddowes because the Stride murder wasn't enough to satisfy his blood lust was there right from the start and hardly goes against common sense. It is also fully backed up by case after case of serial offenders in more recent decades producing similar double events when their first victim either survives or fails to tick all the boxes.

Post hoc ergo propter hoc. Just because the theory is old doesn't mean in is logical. It is in fact fallacy. Serial killers retreat after failure far more often than they escalate.

My mom's friend was shot in the head with a .44 coming home from work the same night as a Son of Sam murder. They were very excited because she lived and they thought she would identify the serial killer. She identified the man who shot her, but it wasn't Berkowitz. It was a dumb kid. Murders continue with or without a serial killer in the news.

There were 11 knife murders of adult women recorded for the whole of England in 1887 and again in 1889, while in 1888 I think the figure was 16 or 17, so there was no sign of any slacking off, just 5 or 6 more knife murders of adult women that year, all accounted for in just one teeny-tiny part of the country's capital, all pretty spectacular, all with no apparent motive and all unsolved.

Sure, but lets say four of the murders were the work of a serial killer, and one was due to a failed blackmailing attempt. That's four extras because of the serial killer, and one that was in the 11 knife murders that statistically was already accounted for.

Exactly. Nothing unusual that year if we can put the extra 5 or 6 knife murders of adult women down to that presence in Whitechapel.

And we can. Three at least. One is a bit of an outlier, and one has absolutely nothing tying Jack the Ripper to the crime other that they were both in the same neighborhood at the same time. Maybe. If there was stuff in these women's personal lives that put them at added risk for assault or murder, and there was... not even counting being prostitutes, then it's far more likely that someone much closer to home was the killer. 80% of people are killed by someone they know. Maybe not like or hang out with, but know. I mean if we are going to be honest about the likelihood of an given scenario, we have to ask ourselves what says "Jack the Ripper" about each murder, and if the answer is "nothing", then we may need to revisit.

Post hoc ergo propter hoc. We cannot say that Stride was a victim of Jack's because Eddowes was. If there is evidence of some kind that does link the murder of Stride to Jack the Ripper, then let that stand on it's own. But if the only way Stride makes sense is because a:Who else was going around cutting throats and b: Eddowes murder meant that Jack was dissatisfid with Stride, then there is no case against Jack in the murder of Stride, in which case we have to fall back on the 80% statistic. Because apparently 11 other guys were running around cutting throats regardless of what Jack did, and each murder has to stand on its own. It can't be propped up by another murder.

Love,

Caz
X

[GUT]

G'Day c.d.

So there were knife murders. How many of them died from a cut to the throat and how many of those were prostitutes? How many women were murdered that had no other injuries other than the cut throat? Finally, how many women were murdered who were prostitutes and died from a cut to the throat without any other apparent injury and no apparent motive? There are knife murders and then there are knife murders.

GOOD questions

G.U.T.

[pinkmoon]

Sorry PinkMoon,

Didn't see your post. Didn't mean to steal your thunder.

c.d.

I forgive you however I was tempted to take you to pub talk for a"outside in the car park"

[c.d.]

So there were knife murders. How many of them died from a cut to the throat and how many of those were prostitutes? How many women were murdered that had no other injuries other than the cut throat? Finally, how many women were murdered who were prostitutes and died from a cut to the throat without any other apparent injury and no apparent motive? There are knife murders and then there are knife murders.

c.d.

[GUT]

Perhaps he just took 'em where he found 'em, if he thought it was safe enough.

GUT

[c.d.]

Sorry PinkMoon,

Didn't see your post. Didn't mean to steal your thunder.

c.d.

[c.d.]

Hello Caroline.

"The suggestion that Jack may have gone on to find Eddowes because the Stride murder wasn't enough to satisfy his blood lust was there right from the start and hardly goes against common sense."

Indeed. But it does NOT sit well with the claim that "Jack" had Mitre sq staked out and hence knew when each constable would arrive and depart.

Cheers.
LC

Hello Lynn,

Perhaps he relied on Eddowes for that.

c.d.

[GUT]

G'Day all

I keep reading about knife murders in England

87 - 11
88 - 17
89 - 11

Can anyone tell me how many of those went unsolved.

Thanks in advance

GUT

[pinkmoon]

Hello Caroline.

"The suggestion that Jack may have gone on to find Eddowes because the Stride murder wasn't enough to satisfy his blood lust was there right from the start and hardly goes against common sense."

Indeed. But it does NOT sit well with the claim that "Jack" had Mitre sq staked out and hence knew when each constable would arrive and depart.

Cheers.
LC

Hi Lynn,quite possible that eddowes took her killer there she might well have used mitre square before so she would know the beats of the police also would she have known if the police didn't always go through the square but popped in for a skive with the nightwatchman in the warehouse.

[lynn cates]

not sitting well

Hello Caroline.

"The suggestion that Jack may have gone on to find Eddowes because the Stride murder wasn't enough to satisfy his blood lust was there right from the start and hardly goes against common sense."

Indeed. But it does NOT sit well with the claim that "Jack" had Mitre sq staked out and hence knew when each constable would arrive and depart.

Cheers.
LC

[caz]

It's far more likely that it was a serial with a one off or two. Stride could have been killed by someone she pissed off. Which as a prostitute was not tough to do. There's nothing at her murder scene or about her body that suggests that Jack killed her. The suggestion comes from the idea that there can't possibly be two killers, and the retrospective idea that Eddowes murder was caused by Jack not finishing Stride.

Hmmm, the 'suggestion' comes from a whole lot more than that, Errata, and 'there can't possibly be two killers' is nonsense, since nobody has ever had Jack down for every single case of murder that year. The suggestion that Jack may have gone on to find Eddowes because the Stride murder wasn't enough to satisfy his blood lust was there right from the start and hardly goes against common sense. It is also fully backed up by case after case of serial offenders in more recent decades producing similar double events when their first victim either survives or fails to tick all the boxes.

I mean, there were what, 15 throat cutting murders a year before Jack? Theres no reason for that number to slack off just because someone out there is doing it in a more spectacular fashion.

There were 11 knife murders of adult women recorded for the whole of England in 1887 and again in 1889, while in 1888 I think the figure was 16 or 17, so there was no sign of any slacking off, just 5 or 6 more knife murders of adult women that year, all accounted for in just one teeny-tiny part of the country's capital, all pretty spectacular, all with no apparent motive and all unsolved.

It's not about something in the water. It's about life going on as usual despite the presence of a serial killer.

Exactly. Nothing unusual that year if we can put the extra 5 or 6 knife murders of adult women down to that presence in Whitechapel.

Love,

Caz
X

[GUT]

G'Day

Found it thanks, just after I found the search function

G.U.T.