William Magrath

[mariab]

Thank you so much, again, for all the information. I assume that people have checked The Freeman's Journal and other such papers for a possible published letter or mention of Magrath? I wish I could look myself (digitally), if I had the time. (But I'm totally clueless in Fenianism, and I'll be looking for information and sources in Paris, pertaining to Lacassagne's papers, to the Okhrana, and to some other things.)

[Chris]

And another newbie question: Were there any Fenian newspapers circulating in London similar to Der Arbeter Fraint for Jewish socialists/anarchists? And did “Dr. Tumblety“ post any advertisements for his “line of work“ in any London newspapers?

Again, I'm probably not the best person to ask - and perhaps someone can correct me if I'm wrong - but I assume people in London would have read the nationalist newspapers published in Ireland. Some of them are mentioned in the Wikipedia article on the Freeman's Journal, which was the oldest Irish nationalist newspaper (it is included in the British Library's digital collection of 19th-century newspapers as far as 1900):

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freeman's_Journal

Of course, there were also Irish nationalist newspapers published in the USA.

[mariab]

To Chris:
Thank you so much for the information. It's great that the Foreign Office's "Fenian Brotherhood" series are available at the British National Archives. (For a minute I thought that you were referring to the American Foreign office, thus to sources in America.) It sounds like these series are voluminous and no inventory exists, but I'm sure that at some point in the future someone will take the time to go through them.
And another newbie question: Were there any Fenian newspapers circulating in London similar to Der Arbeter Fraint for Jewish socialists/anarchists? And did “Dr. Tumblety“ post any advertisements for his “line of work“ in any London newspapers?
With many-many apologies for keeping firing newbie questions. Thank you.

[Chris]

Thank you so much for all the information.
When you characterize the Foreign Office's "Fenian Brotherhood" series as “impenetrable“, do you mean in their content, or as hard to get access to?

They're not hard to get access to, as they are available on microfilm at the National Archives (and presumably elsewhere). But it wasn't clear (to me) how they were organised and whether it would be feasible to find references to a particular person without weeks of searching.

And there has been NO connection found pertaining to Tumblety so far, I assume... No Irish club in London, or something that they both might have attended...

Not that I'm aware of. We know virtually nothing about Magrath's activities in London, and what we do know is included in the wiki article. The other problem is that I don't know very much about Tumblety, though obviously others such as R. J. Palmer who do are aware of the research on Magrath.

[mariab]

To Chris:
Thank you so much for all the information.
When you characterize the Foreign Office's "Fenian Brotherhood" series as “impenetrable“, do you mean in their content, or as hard to get access to?
I think I agree about Magrath's Irish nationalism most possibly having been of the artistic, sentimental kind. I wonder if there was a tangible action that attracted the attention of the police to him, or if it wasn't simply the fact that he was a relatively known artist travelling between England, Ireland, and America. But then again, “in connection to the Whitechapel investigation“? And there has been NO connection found pertaining to Tumblety so far, I assume... No Irish club in London, or something that they both might have attended...

[Chris]

I have a couple questions about things I've been curious about:
- From Magrath's statement in the Phoenix Park (posted here by Debra Arif) it appears to me that he most clearly wasn't a “radical“ Fenian at all, but possibly pro-Parnell. Has anyone yet conducted research about any political activity of Magrath's in New York?
- Please forgive me for being so ignorant (as a newbie), but is there any other possibility besides the newspapers and The Old Bailey to establish if Magrath was ever arrested out of political suspicion while in England? Are there any AVAILABLE police files (pertaining to questioned/arrested Irish residents in Victorian England) to go through? I assume that this has been already researched?

Thanks for your comments.

I think between us we've looked at most of the obvious sources, so any suggestions about where else to try will be gratefully received. One source that might possibly shed light on Magrath's activities in America is the Foreign Office's "Fenian Brotherhood" series (FO 5; referred to by Christy Campbell). I've had a brief look at that, but it seemed pretty impenetrable, so it may not be easy to check.

But so far there is very little indication of any political activity - or even opinions - at all. As you say, the comments about the Phoenix Park murders suggest Magrath didn't support violent action. The impression I get is that his nationalism was of an altogether more sentimental nature. But then again, presumably there was something tangible that attracted the attention of the police to him.

[mariab]

Many-many thanks to Chris, Debra Arif, and Roger Palmer for the impressively well-documented expanded article on William Magrath in the wiki section of Casebook.
I have a couple questions about things I've been curious about:
- From Magrath's statement in the Phoenix Park (posted here by Debra Arif) it appears to me that he most clearly wasn't a “radical“ Fenian at all, but possibly pro-Parnell. Has anyone yet conducted research about any political activity of Magrath's in New York?
- Please forgive me for being so ignorant (as a newbie), but is there any other possibility besides the newspapers and The Old Bailey to establish if Magrath was ever arrested out of political suspicion while in England? Are there any AVAILABLE police files (pertaining to questioned/arrested Irish residents in Victorian England) to go through? I assume that this has been already researched?
Very possibly I'm missing information here that other Ripperologists are aware of, but the only details I know about Magrath is his twice being mentioned in the Special Branch ledgers (as “connected to the Whitechapel murders“) and his probable residence at 57 Bedford Gardens.
Thank you.

[Chris]

I've uploaded an expanded version of the article on William Magrath in the wiki section of Casebook:

http://wiki.casebook.org/index.php/William_Magrath

Many thanks to Debra Arif and R. J. Palmer for their help.

[Debra A]

Debra,

You post great stuff. I mean, just consistently relevant.

Thanks,

Mike

Thanks Mike, I really appreciate that.

[The Good Michael]

Debra,

You post great stuff. I mean, just consistently relevant.

Thanks,

Mike

[Debra A]

Hello Debra. Nice find.

Was he questioned in regards to Phoenix Park or JTR, or does anyone know?

Cheers.
LC

Thanks, Lynn,
The only reason I posted the Phoenix Park snippet was because it's one of the only things I have seen where Magrath makes any type of political comment.
All we have are the two SB ledger entries.

[lynn cates]

questioning

Hello Debra. Nice find.

Was he questioned in regards to Phoenix Park or JTR, or does anyone know?

Cheers.
LC

[Debra A]

The comment about his reaction to the Phoenix Park murders I had previously seen only in a publication from 1899. I'm not sure quite what to make of it. On the one hand, it suggests he was not a supporter of political violence. But on the other, the reaction seems rather irrational, and maybe smacks a little of "protesting too much."

Yes, it does seems a rather random comment, almost defensive, as if there was some suspicion or rumour about where his sympathies lay.

[Chris]

I found this photograph of William Magrath, artist, in an 1894 magazine.
The photograph itself isn't dated but must be before 1894 and certainly after the 1873 self portrait you found.
Perhaps a closer likeness of how Magrath may have looked in 1888?

Muncey's Magazine, Volume 11. page 344. 1894

Thanks very much for posting this. I'm sure it does give us a better idea of what Magrath looked like at the time of the murders. As suggested by the other pictures, I think he looks a pretty old 50 (certainly by modern standards).

The comment about his reaction to the Phoenix Park murders I had previously seen only in a publication from 1899. I'm not sure quite what to make of it. On the one hand, it suggests he was not a supporter of political violence. But on the other, the reaction seems rather irrational, and maybe smacks a little of "protesting too much."

[Debra A]

Phoenix Park murders

A snippet on Magrath's feelings about the Phoenix Park murders.

'The outlook' Vol 50 part 2 29 Dec 1894