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  • Originally posted by MrBarnett View Post
    Although blind, he was occasionally described as a wood carver, an occupation requiring the use of sharp implements, which a homeless man would have presumably carried on his person.
    Interesting...if he was the Ripper, it explains how he managed to operate in such low light conditions.
    Also, didn't someone suggsst that Mary Kelly's thighs could have been strippee by a woodworking tool called a draw-knife? It's all making sense now.

    Comment


    • Originally posted by Joshua Rogan View Post
      Interesting...if he was the Ripper, it explains how he managed to operate in such low light conditions.
      Also, didn't someone suggsst that Mary Kelly's thighs could have been strippee by a woodworking tool called a draw-knife? It's all making sense now.
      Hi Joshua,

      Do I detect a note of scepticism in your response?

      I've never considered Fogarty as the Ripper, but I think he warrants consideration as a possible killer of Tabram. I mean, how many vicious, mentally unstable individuals do we know who married the last person to see a WM victim alive? A person who tried to finger a seemingly innocent man for the crime?


      Gary
      Last edited by MrBarnett; 06-23-2018, 06:03 AM.

      Comment


      • Originally posted by MrBarnett View Post
        Do I detect a note of scepticism in your response?
        Actually, no! Apologies if it came across that way. He seems as good a suspect as any, especially as you say for the Tabram murder.

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        • Iím still not sure how if behooved the Ripper to give the police his first name, workplace, and home address but lie about his surname?

          Comment


          • Originally posted by MrBarnett View Post
            In that case, what name would have been used when registering his kids at school? The register would have been filled out by the school and if they were called Lechmere at school and Cross at home that would be a bit odd.
            Iím assuming that this is hypothetical Gary? Or do we know how he registered his children?

            If we donít know (and I genuinely donít) maybe he registered them as Cross? My only thinking on this is that maybe he didnít see registering his children at school as something legally binding?

            I accept your point though of course. I donít have a real answer.
            Regards

            Herlock






            "There is nothing more deceptive than an obvious fact!"

            Comment


            • Originally posted by MrBarnett View Post
              Hi Joshua,

              Do I detect a note of scepticism in your response?

              I've never considered Fogarty as the Ripper, but I think he warrants consideration as a possible killer of Tabram. I mean, how many vicious, mentally unstable individuals do we know who married the last person to see a WM victim alive? A person who tried to finger a seemingly innocent man for the crime?


              Gary
              I recall reading your Fogarty research over on the JTRForum and thinking that youíve come up with the likeliest killer of Martha Tabram. Have any authors caught onto this Gary? Has Fogarty been mentioned?
              Regards

              Herlock






              "There is nothing more deceptive than an obvious fact!"

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Herlock Sholmes View Post
                Iím assuming that this is hypothetical Gary? Or do we know how he registered his children?

                If we donít know (and I genuinely donít) maybe he registered them as Cross? My only thinking on this is that maybe he didnít see registering his children at school as something legally binding?

                I accept your point though of course. I donít have a real answer.
                No, they were registered at Betts Street and Essex Street schools (from memory) as Lechmere.

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                • Cheers Gary,

                  Then it seems certain that he used Lechmere every time when it came to anything written officially.

                  Did his mother revert to Lechmere after Thomas Crossí death?
                  Regards

                  Herlock






                  "There is nothing more deceptive than an obvious fact!"

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by Herlock Sholmes;450867i
                    Cheers Gary,

                    Then it seems certain that he used Lechmere every time when it came to anything written officially.

                    Did his mother revert to Lechmere after Thomas Crossí death?
                    She remarried a man named Joseph Forsdike and as far as I know used that name until she died.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Herlock Sholmes View Post
                      I recall reading your Fogarty research over on the JTRForum and thinking that youíve come up with the likeliest killer of Martha Tabram. Have any authors caught onto this Gary? Has Fogarty been mentioned?
                      Hi Michael,

                      I drafted a long, waffly response to this and it disappeared.

                      Probably just as well😉

                      The short answer is there's been some interest but I'm not aware anything has been put together by anyone.

                      Gary

                      Comment


                      • Did he ever use the name Lechmere when Cross senior was still alive, or the name Cross (other than in a context where he was already using it) after he'd died?

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Joshua Rogan View Post
                          Did he ever use the name Lechmere when Cross senior was still alive, or the name Cross (other than in a context where he was already using it) after he'd died?
                          He and his sister were Christened after his mother (Maria) had married Thomas Cross and the name Lechmere was recorded. Thomas Cross had only been dead a year or so, and Maria hadn't yet remarried, when CAL married using the name Lechmere in 1870.

                          There are only two examples currently known where he used the name Cross after his stepfather had died. One was during the Nichols case and the other (which we can't be certain was him) was when the child was run over in 1876.

                          He had been listed as Cross on the 1861 census. In theory, Thomas Cross, as head of the household was responsible for providing that info, but Maria may have had a hand in it. CAL was 11/12, so we can be reasonably confident that the use of Cross wasn't his idea.
                          Last edited by MrBarnett; 06-23-2018, 09:09 AM.

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by MrBarnett View Post
                            Hi Michael,

                            I drafted a long, waffly response to this and it disappeared.

                            Probably just as well😉

                            The short answer is there's been some interest but I'm not aware anything has been put together by anyone.

                            Gary
                            Cheers Gary,

                            Fogarty appears to provide a plausible reason for Pollís reticence when it came to the police and also it might explain her willingness to identify innocent soldiers as Marthaís killer.

                            If Foggy was only feigning blindness......
                            Regards

                            Herlock






                            "There is nothing more deceptive than an obvious fact!"

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by MrBarnett View Post
                              She remarried a man named Joseph Forsdike and as far as I know used that name until she died.
                              Maybe he didnít like his mother remarrying and so he made a point of calling himself Cross in protest?

                              The only thing that I feel confident in is that he gained no advantage by calling himself Cross so I see no sinister motive. Nonetheless itís still interesting to know why he used Cross as we cannot prove that he used it in everyday life (though Iíve always felt it likely.) If we could prove that Ďaccident maní and Ďwitness maní were one and the same then we would have our answer.
                              Regards

                              Herlock






                              "There is nothing more deceptive than an obvious fact!"

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Herlock Sholmes View Post
                                Cheers Gary,

                                Fogarty appears to provide a plausible reason for Pollís reticence when it came to the police and also it might explain her willingness to identify innocent soldiers as Marthaís killer.

                                If Foggy was only feigning blindness......
                                What I should make clear here is that there is no definitive proof that Poll and Foggy were an item in 1888. But we do know they both frequented NE Passsge and the St Geo E workhouse/infirmary in the 1880s. They were living together in NEP in mid-1893, alongside 2/3 other prostitutes. They married in December that year and within a very short time Poll was back in the infirmary being treated for the clap.

                                Ed Stow (remember him?) has questioned whether Fogarty was actually blind. His 1906 Hellingly notes state that he was completely blind. How much of a hindrance would that have been on the dark GYB landing, I wonder?

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