Fleming/Hutchinson theory?

[Sally]

Where's this census entry then?

[DVV]

he is therefore not Toppy or any other guy in London called GH

Absolutely, Malcolm.

And nobody will ever find George, for he was Joseph.

[Rubyretro]

=Malcolm X;198875]

sorry but i'm still not convinced with this at all, JTR would have needed somewhere where he could store his gear, read newspapers at night, gloat, and be very secretive/private.

A wife would never have allowed that, Malcolm. She would have kept on and on pestering him, until he had confessed all. She would have noticed the tiniest blood spot on his clothes

but in this place he's be disturbed by other residents all the tme

,
If he lived with a house full of kids, as Mr Lechmere would have you believe,
he may have dreamed of moving to the Victoria Home where he could sit about and read the paper all night, pop out for a pint whenever he chose, or rustle up his favourite dish of curried organs and only have washing up for one.

i.e they'd be continually wanting to talk to him, thus they'd be way too nosey, they would probably go through his belongings too, when he shot off to the toilet, or went to make a cup of coffee

.....
This is the role of Mrs Lechmere/Cross ! (you've never been married Malcolm, I can tell..)

``Daddy's playing with his toy Aircraft again``, but in a busy lodging house all of this will be impossible.

In a busy lodging house, none of the other men would think it strange if he wanted to be alone to play with his "toy aircraft", a wife just wouldn't understand..

thus in my opinion, JTR would not be living in a dormitory all week long with loads of others

.
It would be by far the best place be just one weirdo amongst many and having the luxury of doing what he wanted with his spare time !

if i was JTR and visiting Whitechapel, which it looks like he definitely did ( i.e the murders suddenly started/ suddenly stopped) then i would never stay in a busy lodging house with loads of others, this is rediculous, i would rent a large room only, because in here i can store all my stuff plus be as private as i want.

Only if you could afford it, Malcolm ! You might not have the choice...

GH is highly suspicious

,
YES. He certainly is.

PLUS, this GH that went to the police definitely lived in Victoria homes, because this is the hardest thing of all to lie about, so this weakens him as JTR.

NO. It makes him a very good candidate.

[Lechmere]

Malcolm - I think you are rationalising things in a sensible manner there.

[Malcolm X]

Listen Malcolm, there is an expression 'can't see the wood for the trees' :
the killer, whoever he was, would surely have drawn less attention to himself
hidden amongst the hundreds of rootless men coming and going in a crowded lodging house, then he would trying to sneak in and out of a house with a pocket full of kidney under the gimlet gaze of one nosey wife.

There were surely enough bits of revolting offal, wrapped in a bit of paper, and scewed into a stained pocket, and produced in the communal kitchens, to attract no particular questions.

It is absolutely risible that any lodging house would deny it's lodgers the
right to accept honest work at any time that work was offered ; They evidently offered a pass. Men would leave at an extremely early hour to stand in line and apply for casual work. They might even leave for days and come back (as shown by Hutchinson's looking for work in Romford).
Lodgers in the Victoria home were not living in a prison.

Be very wary of that nasty Lechmere, Malcolm....you never see him spending time on Druitt or Tumblety threads.....he badly wants to discredit Hutchinson as a suspect since he knows in his heart that Hutchinson is a more plausible candidate than his own favourite ! Don't be swayed.

sorry but i'm still not convinced with this at all, JTR would have needed somewhere where he could store his gear, read newspapers at night, gloat, and be very secretive/private.

but in this place he's be disturbed by other residents all the tme, i.e they'd be continually wanting to talk to him, thus they'd be way too nosey, they would probably go through his belongings too, when he shot off to the toilet, or went to make a cup of coffee..... especially if they thought that this guy was a bit odd !!!

a serial killer nearly always has a ``wolfs lair`` and if lives on his own in his own home, this will be all of it, i.e Dahlmar/ Neilson, these types can afford to leave evidence lieing around (at first).....A serial killer can do all of this at home with a family too, because he'll have his own study/ basement/ garden shed/garage etc, where he can read newspapers and cut out articles, clean his car interior, shove his clothing into the washing machine, prepare himself for his next murder etc, he can do all of this while his kids are thinking ``Daddy's playing with his toy Aircraft again``, but in a busy lodging house all of this will be impossible.

thus in my opinion, JTR would not be living in a dormitory all week long with loads of others.

if i was JTR and visiting Whitechapel, which it looks like he definitely did ( i.e the murders suddenly started/ suddenly stopped) then i would never stay in a busy lodging house with loads of others, this is rediculous, i would rent a large room only, because in here i can store all my stuff plus be as private as i want.

GH is highly suspicious, but yet again he could also be innocent, H fans need to really think about this, because JTR almost definitely left Whitechapel soon after MJK, he is therefore not Toppy or any other guy in London called GH, He can only really be a visitor to London called GH.

PLUS, this GH that went to the police definitely lived in Victoria homes, because this is the hardest thing of all to lie about, so this weakens him as JTR.

[DVV]

He also gave his settlement in November 1888 as being the Victoria Home when he went to the Workhouse hospital.

No, that was in Nov 1889.

And that makes quite a difference.

[DVV]

Hi Lechmere

Sally do you want me to post up a real copy of the census return?

Indeed you should. I didn't know "our" Fleming had been found in the 1891 census.

[Sally]

Sally do you want me to post up a real copy of the census return?

What, the whole thing? I fear it would take up rather a lot of space. No, in the interests of space saving etc., just the relevant entry will do.

You're not stallling here, are you Lechmere?

[DVV]

Ah ok. Eh bien Joe the Ripper faisait 5'7 à mon avis.

Merci ma chère

[Rubyretro]

Who's Lofty ? (Grrr, I'm sure I'm missing something funny here)

[/QUOTE]

c'est un surnom qui veut dire 'grand gigue' (un escogriffe ?)

[DVV]

Hi Stephen

And 6 foot 7 inches too.

Even the second rows weren't that tall when I was playing rugby.

Who's Lofty ? (Grrr, I'm sure I'm missing something funny here)

[DVV]

Hi Jon

as I said, the few details given about Fleming match too much with GH story.
Imo GH did not lie when he said he had known MJK for about 3 years, etc.

And that's why Abberline swallowed the whole story.

Amitiés
dvvvvvv

[Stephen Thomas]

And 6 foot 7 inches too.

He could have gone on Eastenders and got called Lofty

[Wickerman]

Hutch said he knew Mary for about 3 years, ie : before she moved to Spitalfields/Whitechapel.

"Had known her about 3 years" might not imply contiuously seeing her over three years. It could mean nothing more than he first met her three years ago, and occasionally since.

Besides, about 1885 Kelly was living down at Breezers Hill, which is approx. the same distance south of Dutfields Yd. as Mitre Sq. is to the west.
Breezers Hill is pretty close, and in 1886 Kelly moved north to Commercial Rd.

If Hutchinson was a local, why couldn't they have known each other?

Regards, Jon S.

[Lechmere]

Sally do you want me to post up a real copy of the census return?

Mrs Retro - you weren't sent that and cut and pasted it from a PM - did you?
You know as well as I do what the Victoria Home rules state in black and white!