A Likely Suspect?

[Trevor Marriott]

That would be more than basic knowledge of English, no? .

Lets put it this way: would it be more unusual that a guy with his temperament and limited education be able to pick up English, beyond a few phrases, 140 years ago.

than having a lawyer that knew German or made use of a translator.?

Feigenbaun must have had a basic knowledge of English as he had a conversation with a police officer at the time of his arrest and also when he was booked into custody at the police station and the fact that he had been resident in the US for a lengthy period of time prior to his arrest after giving up his job as a merchant seaman !!!!!!!!!!!

https://www.trevormarriott.co.uk

[Newbie]

Hi Karl
There is no evidence to show that he did not have a basic knowledge of English. If he didn't speak any English then how would Lawton been able to communicate with him, and take instructions from him regarding his trial and the defence he put forward. There was never any mention made of the use of an interpreter other than at court, which is what you would expect to happen in the interests of fair play when someone is not fully conversant with the language.

Of course we cannot be certain that the man seen and referred to by the witness was the killer

www.trevormarriott.co.uk

That would be more than basic knowledge of English, no? .

Lets put it this way: would it be more unusual that a guy with his temperament and limited education be able to pick up English, beyond a few phrases, 140 years ago.

than having a lawyer that knew German or made use of a translator.?

[Abby Normal]

It must have been the shabby genteel Lederhosen.

now that's funny

[Sam Flynn]

Heeey, maybe there was something to this "leather apron" after all!

I think we're onto something, Karl.

[Karl]

It must have been the shabby genteel Lederhosen.

Heeey, maybe there was something to this "leather apron" after all!

[Harry D]

Your right, I dont accept the canonical murders as being the work of the same killer, furthermore, if Feigenabum did ever kill here in The UK as is being suggested, then he might have only been responsible for one some or perhaps all.

And for your info Feigenabaum was a merchant sailor and according to shipping records had been so for many years, and was on ships that after the WM ceased sailed back and forth between The US and Germany where other similar murders took place. So it is right and proper to look closely at those murders.

But then again if you had read my book you would have known that wouldn't you, and you wouldn't have opened your mouth without first engaging your brain.

www.trevormarriott.co.uk

Your selling technique needs some work, Trev.

[Trevor Marriott]

Some guy cut a woman's throat on the other side of the Atlantic, six years after the Ripper scare, and he's supposed to be a suspect, why?

I recall that Trev tried to buttress his case for Feigenbaum by linking the sailor to a string of other "Ripper-like" murders across the globe. From his other postings on the site, it appears Trev doesn't even accept the canonical five as Ripper murders, so which is it?

Your right, I dont accept the canonical murders as being the work of the same killer, furthermore, if Feigenabum did ever kill here in The UK as is being suggested, then he might have only been responsible for one some or perhaps all.

And for your info Feigenabaum was a merchant sailor and according to shipping records had been so for many years, and was on ships that after the WM ceased sailed back and forth between The US and Germany where other similar murders took place. So it is right and proper to look closely at those murders.

But then again if you had read my book you would have known that wouldn't you, and you wouldn't have opened your mouth without first engaging your brain.

https://www.trevormarriott.co.uk

[Sam Flynn]

I certainly can't differentiate between a white Englishman and a white German just by appearance.

It must have been the shabby genteel Lederhosen.

[Karl]

I think you need to re visit the evidence again. Mrs Long is the witness you refer to she apparently saw the victim, talking to a man who she described as a foreigner aged about 40. Feigenbaum would have been around 48 at that time.

However her evidence and the evidence of Cadosh is in direct conflict with Dr Phillips who suggests the time of death could have been much earlier. So there is a big doubt about that person being the killer in any event if she was mistaken.

www.trevormarriott.co.uk

If Feigenbaum was around 48 at that time, surely Long would have described him as aged about 50, not 40? Unless Feigenbaum had a particularly youthful appearance. But she would certainly hear the difference between "will you" and "vill yoo" - in a German accent, every single syllable would have sounded distinctly different from a native speaker's. Long might not have been able to identify it as specifically German, but she would have been able to identify it as foreign.

By the way, if Feigenbaum was an ethnic German, I shouldn't say he would have looked particularly foreign. I certainly can't differentiate between a white Englishman and a white German just by appearance.

[Harry D]

Some guy cut a woman's throat on the other side of the Atlantic, six years after the Ripper scare, and he's supposed to be a suspect, why?

I recall that Trev tried to buttress his case for Feigenbaum by linking the sailor to a string of other "Ripper-like" murders across the globe. From his other postings on the site, it appears Trev doesn't even accept the canonical five as Ripper murders, so which is it?

[Trevor Marriott]

Hi All,
Very interesting discussion, but thought it time to give you a little gem.

I have researched Magdalena Strohband - she was supposedly Carl Feigenbaum's sister-in-law, to whom he left his final possessions & communicated with before his execution.
Magdalena was married to a gentleman (German) named Rheiner Kosch who had a brother named Karl (with a K).
From this we can deduce it likely that Feigenbaum's real name was Karl Kosch.

I then tracked the movements of Karl Kosch, the sailor, and apart from a short stay in Portsmouth in 1884 I cannot find him anywhere near London - but, let me point out that this is far from conclusive proof.
What I did find is Karl Kosch on a ship sailing to South America in 1888, the port of call being Nicaragua.
Interesting point - Nicaragua's main fruit export was figs - German name for 'fig tree'? Feigenbaum!
From this we can probably deduce that this is when he changed his name as his next trip was to North America, and from there the trail goes cold until he is picked up as Carl Feigenbaum.

Make what you like of my research, which I did present to Mr.Marriott about a year ago after reading his book, but one thing I can assure you is that I am very thorough. Although his book is very interesting, the theory cannot be upheld when the even the identity of the suspect is in question.
No malice intended Trevor.

Amanda

A belated reply to this earlier posting re the real identity of Carl Feigenbaum

It was suggested at his trial that his real name was Anton Zahn. I found out that there was an Anton Zahn who was born in Gau-Bickelheim, and did in fact have a sister called Magdalena and a brother called Johann. It is unclear as to whether this brother is the same person named John mentioned during the trial of Feigenbaum, and the same person who gave a press interview in New York the day before the execution.

https://www.trevormarriott.co.uk

[Trevor Marriott]

There is no proof that the man who uttered those words is the killer, no, but he is a far more likely candidate than Carl Feigenbaum - against whom there is no proof, either. Point taken about the interpreter, though: We cannot really ascertain Feigenbaum's language proficiency.

I think you need to re visit the evidence again. Mrs Long is the witness you refer to she apparently saw the victim, talking to a man who she described as a foreigner aged about 40. Feigenbaum would have been around 48 at that time.

However her evidence and the evidence of Cadosh is in direct conflict with Dr Phillips who suggests the time of death could have been much earlier. So there is a big doubt about that person being the killer in any event if she was mistaken.

https://www.trevormarriott.co.uk

[Karl]

As stated there is no proof that the man who uttered those words was in fact the killer, in any event, and I can tell you that in the course of my daily work I come across foreigners who can speak and have a basic understanding of the English language but in the interest of justice many are give the services of an interpreter when being interviewed.

www.trevormarriott.co.uk

There is no proof that the man who uttered those words is the killer, no, but he is a far more likely candidate than Carl Feigenbaum - against whom there is no proof, either. Point taken about the interpreter, though: We cannot really ascertain Feigenbaum's language proficiency.

[Trevor Marriott]

As I understand it, he required the services of an interpreter during his trial. This suggests at the very least a thick accent on his part, which would have been very noticeable even in the two small words, "will you".

As stated there is no proof that the man who uttered those words was in fact the killer, in any event, and I can tell you that in the course of my daily work I come across foreigners who can speak and have a basic understanding of the English language but in the interest of justice many are give the services of an interpreter when being interviewed.

https://www.trevormarriott.co.uk

[Karl]

Hi Karl
There is no evidence to show that he did not have a basic knowledge of English. If he didn't speak any English then how would Lawton been able to communicate with him, and take instructions from him regarding his trial and the defence he put forward. There was never any mention made of the use of an interpreter other than at court, which is what you would expect to happen in the interests of fair play when someone is not fully conversant with the language.

Of course we cannot be certain that the man seen and referred to by the witness was the killer

www.trevormarriott.co.uk

As I understand it, he required the services of an interpreter during his trial. This suggests at the very least a thick accent on his part, which would have been very noticeable even in the two small words, "will you". Now, I am leaning more and more in favour of the five canonical murders having been perpetrated by up to as many as five different killers, but even if Feigenbaum was one of them, I do not see him as a likely suspect for all of them. Not least because foreigners - then as now - are noticed more easily than locals, and people are ever prepared - then as now - to blame foreigners. Yet people seemed more eager to blame the Jews than shady sailors with conspicuous accents.