Buck's Row Timings

[David Orsam]

By happy chance, on what was a sunny day in London, I had the opportunity to visit Durward Street again to collect a little bit more data. I wanted to fill in a gap in the timings because I had previously not timed the walk down the modern route from Doveton Street to Durward Street through the Sainsburys walkway. I suspect this was the route that Fisherman took in the TV documentary with Andy Griffiths although it did not exist in 1888. The exact route was: from Doveton Street into Wickford Street then into Cephas Street then down Cambridge Heath Road into Darling Row through the Sainsburys walkway across Brady Street into Durward Street.

There were two differences between the walk I did and Fisherman's presumed walk. Firstly, I started the journey from the front door of one of the houses in the middle of Doveton Street whereas Fisherman and AG appear to have started from the street (saving a few seconds). Secondly, it is not currently possible to walk to the exact site of the murder due to construction work for Crossrail so I had to end the walk at a barrier some distance from where the body was found.

The philosophy behind this walk was to walk slowly at a leisurely pace but not ridiculously slowly. To give you an idea, while it was certainly much slower than my normal work (which is quite fast), I nevertheless overtook a couple of middle aged/elderly Asian women at one point while I was walking along Cambridge Heath Road. I also matched the pace of a couple of other adult males at points during the walk before they turned off the route. So I don’t think I was walking unreasonably slowly.

I wasn't delayed by any traffic; I did quicken my pace while crossing part of Cambridge Heath Road on both occasions due to cars coming (and didn't attempt to compensate for this at any point).

I carried out the walk in both directions and thought I had done it at the same pace on both occasions but the timings were as follows:

1st attempt: 8 minutes and 25 seconds

2nd attempt: 8 minutes and 50 seconds

Don't forget that it would have taken me at least another 30 seconds at this pace to reach the murder site. Adding on those 30 seconds makes the totals 8:55 and 9:20 respectively.

My conclusion is that a walk of 9 minutes along this modern route is not unreasonable.

I did one extra walk along the same route at what I tried to keep at a more brisk pace, not fast (a bit slower than my normal walk but probably a bit faster than average pace). That took me 6 minutes and 5 seconds.

Finally, and separately, I walked from the end of Durward Street towards the construction barrier and back at both paces just to give an idea of timing over this short distance. At the slow pace I walked it in 1 minute and six seconds at the more normal, brisker, pace it was 46 seconds.

[David Orsam]

No, it's fine, I'm not too far away - a relatively short train ride. The walks are good in understanding the scene. I think the most interesting thing I discovered was just how far Corbet's Court was from Baker's Row - basically the entire length of Hanbury Street - so if Cross saw Paul walk into that court, as he says he did, the two of them must presumably have walked together all the way down Hanbury Street (talking to each other?).

[drstrange169]

Thank you for that David. Hopefully you live locally, I'd hate to think you came down from Scotland to do it!

The police station covered the whole block, so it's difficult to say exactly where Mizen would have entered. Neither do we know if he knew the way or got directions from PC Neil. But, all in all that helps a lot, a clearer picture is slowly emerging, thanks again.

Hello Robert,

Mizen helped load the body onto the ambulance and went to the mortuary with PC Neil and Sergeant Kirby.

[Robert]

Hi GUT

I'd assumed he'd trundle it, as he was going that way anyway, as long as it didn't take too long. But you're right, if someone from the mortuary trundled it, they could then have taken the body to the mortuary - otherwise Mizen would have been even longer away from his beat. That would presumably mean that Mizen didn't see the body loaded on to the ambulance, though, assuming that Mizen outpaced the ambulance trundler so as to get back to his beat more quickly.

[GUT]

Coming back probably a little longer, as he had to trundle the ambulance.

Did he trundle the ambulance, or someone from the mortuary?

[Robert]

Coming back probably a little longer, as he had to trundle the ambulance.

[David Orsam]

Job done. Starting from the construction barrier which is now in Durward Street (a few yards from the murder site), I walked at quite a brisk but not excessively fast pace, like a man on a mission, as Mizen presumably would have been, along the red route in your map - the blue route no longer exists - up Brady Street, right into Three Colts Lane, left into Wilmot Street then right into Ainsley Street. The walk to the top of Ainsley Street took a total of exactly 7 minutes (broken down into: 1:55 from the barrier to 74 Brady Street, now a fried chicken shop, where I paused momentarily to look at it and then 5:05 from there to Ainsley Street). I have no idea where the police station used to be but if it is where the star is on your map, which is the point the street curves towards Bethnal Green, I walked to there and it took a further 36 seconds.

So, depending on where the police station was within the street, and allowing for the few extra seconds from the site to where the construction barrier is, we can say it would probably have taken Mizen about 8 minutes to reach the police-station from the murder site had he walked at a brisk pace. The blue route might have been a little faster.

[David Orsam]

Ah yes, very good, I hadn't registered that previously and I always miss the Abberline report when going through the Sourcebook because it's in the Chapman section. And yes, of course, I did get my H and J the wrong way round. Okay, well, yes then, I will do the walk at the next opportunity and report back when it's done.

[drstrange169]

Hello David,

No better source than Inspector A, himself.


MEPO 3/140, f239

19 Sept 88

"... In the meantime PC Mizen had been sent for the ambulance and assistance from Bethnal Green Station ..."

He came back with the ambulance and a posse of police including Inspector Spartling.

(I guessing you meant Mizen was H div, not J;-)

[David Orsam]

Hi - do you have a reference for a report that he went to Bethnal Green police station? I looked but couldn't find one. I'm just thinking that I don't want to do the walk if we've identified the wrong place!

While I see the logic that Neil would have sent him to Bethnal Green, within H Division, it occurs to me that Mizen (a J Division constable) had already left his beat without any authority and would he really have been comfortable to have "gone missing" for perhaps 20 minutes or half an hour while fetching an ambulance from H Division? For that reason, I have always assumed he turned back into his own Division (presumably Leman Street police station?) and informed a superior officer of what had happened so that they knew where he was and what he was doing (and so that could be replaced on his beat by another constable).

As for Sgt Kirby, note that Buck's Row was on his patrol route. Inspector Spratling's report of 31 August records that Neil "passed through Bucks Row at 3.15am and P.S.10.Kirby about the same time". So I have always assumed that he came across the scene organically through patrolling.

Also, I'd quite like confirmation that the nearest ambulance would definitely have been at a police station.

As you say, this one has Monty written all over it and if we are lucky he will appear.

[drstrange169]

Hello David,

All the reports say he went to the Bethnal Green police station. Monty will correct me if I'm wrong, but that was not only the main station, it was the nearest. It was where PC Neil was based therefore where he would have logically sent for help. Presumably Sgt Kirby, who was also based there, returned with him.

[David Orsam]

Okay, thanks, and why do you think he got it from there?

[drstrange169]

Bethnal Green Police station, J division H.Q. Ainsley Street.

[David Orsam]

Hello David,

If you had a big Christmas and feel like walking it off, I'd be interested to know Mizen's ambulance timings. I'm estimating it was an 8 to 10 minute trip each way depending on which route he took.

Where are you indicating in the map that he got the ambulance from?

[drstrange169]

Hello David,

If you had a big Christmas and feel like walking it off, I'd be interested to know Mizen's ambulance timings. I'm estimating it was an 8 to 10 minute trip each way depending on which route he took.