Knowing

[Michael W Richards]

[QUOTE=Pierre;417713]Well, David, if I was an accomplice for instance, it would have been very difficult for me to notify the police, wouldnīt it?

[QUOTE]

The Pardon for Accomplices signed by Warren Nov 10 speaks for itself. That, to me, makes an explanation for such assistance quite easy, since no matter what the excuse, the assistant could suffer no legal consequences.

Shame has nothing to do with this argument, nor is there any reason to surmise an accomplice felt any.

[Pierre]

Well if I understand your strange question, I guess the answer depends on the type of person you are, if you have standards you live by no matter what, or a spineless little creep?

That is a good answer. It depends on what type of person you are and what standards you live by.

If you are in a high position you will have specific standards, if you have this or that economic situation that will matter as well, and what also matters of course is what you would win or loose by going to the police.

You may for example win or loose your honour. You could also win or loose a position and/or a lot of money.

You could win or loose friends and your own social status.

I think that if I was the accomplice, in 1888, to this specific murderer, the Whitechapel murder, the choice would be very, very difficult.

[GUT]

If you were the killer and you were at the same time Queen Victoria, and I was your accomplice and I was at the same time your servant Abdul Karim: what do you think I would do?

Note that this is a very exaggerated illustrative example used for the purpose of generating a functional explanation.

I think your answer to this may have many interesting angles.

Well if I understand your strange question, I guess the answer depends on the type of person you are, if you have standards you live by no matter what, or a spineless little creep?

[Pierre]

and why wouldnt you approach the police (via a third party perhaps) and say, I'm and accomplice but can give you the real offender in exchange for immunity.

If you were the killer and you were at the same time Queen Victoria, and I was your accomplice and I was at the same time your servant Abdul Karim: what do you think I would do?

Note that this is a very exaggerated illustrative example used for the purpose of generating a functional explanation.

I think your answer to this may have many interesting angles.

[GUT]

Do you mean this:

"Well, David, if I was an accomplice for instance, it would have been very difficult for me to notify the police, wouldnīt it?"

The answer is no, if you've been "made" to be an accomplice. It would be very simple to go to the police in those circumstances.

and why wouldnt you approach the police (via a third party perhaps) and say, I'm and accomplice but can give you the real offender in exchange for immunity.

[David Orsam]

This is where our discussion ends, since the information is not sufficient.

Oh dear, what a shame.

[Pierre]

Do you mean this:

"Well, David, if I was an accomplice for instance, it would have been very difficult for me to notify the police, wouldnīt it?"

The answer is no, if you've been "made" to be an accomplice. It would be very simple to go to the police in those circumstances.

This is where our discussion ends, since the information is not sufficient.

[David Orsam]

But then of course you have not read post 113.

Do you mean this:

"Well, David, if I was an accomplice for instance, it would have been very difficult for me to notify the police, wouldnīt it?"

The answer is no, if you've been "made" to be an accomplice. It would be very simple to go to the police in those circumstances.

[Pierre]

Ah my dear boy, I think I have identified the problem with your narrative.

If I "make you" an accomplice to a murder then you have sufficient evidence to go immediately to the police and give evidence against me thus causing me to be hung by the neck until dead.

But then of course you have not read post 113.

[David Orsam]

I am supposed to have been told by you that you have committed the murders but since I did not believe you, you made me an accomplice.

Ah my dear boy, I think I have identified the problem with your narrative.

If I "make you" an accomplice to a murder then you have sufficient evidence to go immediately to the police and give evidence against me thus causing me to be hung by the neck until dead.

[Pierre]

[QUOTE=David Orsam;417716]

Oh my dear boy, are you so lonely you feel the need to respond to a question from the 20th May just to get me to talk to you?

Dear David, are you so lonely you feel the need to respond just to get me to talk to you?

I wouldn't mind, my dear boy, but you seem to have forgotten the premise of this entire thread, of which a clue is in the title of "knowing".

I wouldnīt mind, David, but you seem to have misunderstood the problem in the thread, since it is an historical problem.

You are not supposed to be an accomplice. You are supposed to have just been told by the murderer that he has committed the murders.

In history I am supposed to be an accomplice. I am supposed to have been told by you that you have committed the murders but since I did not believe you, you made me an accomplice.

If you are now suddenly an accomplice to murder my dear boy then, indeed, that changes matters greatly but you need to get your story straight first.

Since I am your accomplice to murder that changes matters between you an me greatly so what will the story be now?

[David Orsam]

Well, David, if I was an accomplice for instance, it would have been very difficult for me to notify the police, wouldnīt it?

And even if there was a pardon afterwards, think about the shame.

Being an accomplice to the Whitechapel murderer is not a desirable position. My whole life would have been ruined after that, donīt you agree?

Oh my dear boy, are you so lonely you feel the need to respond to a question from the 20th May just to get me to talk to you?

I wouldn't mind, my dear boy, but you seem to have forgotten the premise of this entire thread, of which a clue is in the title of "knowing".

You are not supposed to be an accomplice. You are supposed to have just been told by the murderer that he has committed the murders.

If you are now suddenly an accomplice to murder my dear boy then, indeed, that changes matters greatly but you need to get your story straight first.

[Pierre]

That's all very interesting my dear boy, and indeed charmingly incomprehensible, but there is still no dilemma here. As you say, you don't have enough knowledge of my crimes to be able to have me convicted of murder. So you aren't worried about a charge of misprision of felony. But if, for some irrational reason, you are worried about this, you can simply put an end to the worry by notifying the police of everything you know. So what is the purpose of this thread?

Well, David, if I was an accomplice for instance, it would have been very difficult for me to notify the police, wouldnīt it?

And even if there was a pardon afterwards, think about the shame.

Being an accomplice to the Whitechapel murderer is not a desirable position. My whole life would have been ruined after that, donīt you agree?

[David Orsam]

That's all very interesting my dear boy, and indeed charmingly incomprehensible, but there is still no dilemma here. As you say, you don't have enough knowledge of my crimes to be able to have me convicted of murder. So you aren't worried about a charge of misprision of felony. But if, for some irrational reason, you are worried about this, you can simply put an end to the worry by notifying the police of everything you know. So what is the purpose of this thread?

[Pierre]

[QUOTE=David Orsam;415340]

Oh yes, my dear boy, the damage is certainly done for me, I am doomed to be reported to the police and will have to take my chances that there isn't enough evidence to charge or convict me.

You would not give evidence which could be used for charging or convicting you. You would just give enough evidence for me to know who you are and what you have done, hoping that I will change my strategy.

Those who are high should be low and those who are low should be high. There can be no more shame. Enough damage has been done to your life already. If it continues you will have nothing left. That is what you tell me.

And I agree. The men in the British Empire would not envy you. You have given your life for this nation and still you come out with so very little. Yes, it is a shame.

And to think that the most important thing for you is almost destroyed at a point in time when you are so very weak.

You, however, are in the clear. So for you, it's problem solved.

As long as you must put pressure on me, the problem will not be solved. You continued for a long time tp tell lies to the authorities. You said you were somebody when you were not. Of course you started to regret what you had done. You became scared after a few years. And you confessed. So yes, I know what you have done. But will it ever be spoken of?

Now: If I do not listen to you and you can not scare me enough to listen to you: what can you do about it?