Anderson - More Questions Than Answers

[Jeff Leahy]

Thanks Rob,
All we actually have on this, that we can be certain of, are Anderson"s assertions in Blackwoods Magazine and his autobiography of 1910.
Now its extraordinary that Major Henry Smith,a prominent City Police Chief himself, both during the Ripper scare and later , together with the Editor of the Jewish Chronicle state that he is talking poppycock and that nobody knew who the Ripper was.
We also have Winston Churchill taking strong exception to several revelations Robert Anderson makes ,in this same Blackwoods Magazine.Churchill objects to the "inaccuracies" that run through his assertions,which he puts down to his" advancing years".He also objects to the spirit of "gross boastfulness"-and says that they are written in the style of ,"How Bill Adams won the Battle of Waterloo.----that he just wanted to show how important he was ,how invariably he was right etc etc "---in short Churchill read Anderson"s words and had little time for him or his assertions.


This being the case we need to see whether anything the doctors who admitted him to Colney Hatch and Leavesdon have to say about Aaron Kosminski's illness.
The first record we have is by M.Whitfield on 12 July 1890.The reason given is "query insane".It wasnt serious because he was released three days later.

The second record we have is from 4 February 1891.M,Whitfield is again the admissions officer.Three days later Aaron is transferred to Colney Hatch.

THere are in fact two records for Colney Hatch with slightly different wording.
The "record of admissions" states that he has been 6 years insane [-in the second record there is an alteration from 6 months to 6 years.]


Interestingly the record of admissions states his symptoms are "incoherence"----the cause- "self abuse"

However the second record from the male patients day book states that the cause is "unknown" and then it says in red "self abuse".

the form then has an entry :

DANGEROUS TO OTHERS -:NO

and it states he is not suicidal.

A later doctor"s report refers to him having "aural hallucinations".

At one point in his 30 year incarceration he took up a chair and attempted to strike a charge attendent- 9 Jan 1892 but by Nov 17 1892 the notes state that Aaron is quiet and well behaved--- but only speaks German now-[probably Yiddish].

Aaron is noted also as being able to Read and Write.

The notes describe a few episodes of chronic mania from 1892 onwards but at no point do they retract from their original statement made on admission that Aaron Kosminski was NOT a danger to others.

His condition as he settled into institutional life deteriorated to what was described as "dementia".


Now none of these Hospital and Hospital Doctor"s notes support Anderson"s allegation that Aaron Kosminski had ever had been a "danger to others"---still less had been revelling in blood and was actually Jack the Ripper.

And I believe they would have done,had Aaron Kosminski ever been a danger to others ------which clearly Jack the Ripper was.
Best Wishes
Norma

Norma you are making one basic error.

Schizophrenic's per se are NOT dangerous. If Aaron was JtR. There must have been other factors acting at the time that would make him dangerous.

Probably drugs alcohol or a combination.

We are talking about the on set of Schizophrenia which we would associate at the age of 19-22 years. The first psychotic episodes lasting at periods of 12 weeks. Getting steadily stronger in affect.

Pirate

[Natalie Severn]

Thankyou Chris.

[Chris]

The first record we have is by M.Whitfield on 12 July 1890.The reason given that he had been two years insane.It wasnt serious because he was released three days later.

Just a small point - the record actually says "Qy Insane" (i.e. "Query Insane"), and has been misread in the past as "2y Insane".

[Natalie Severn]

Thanks Rob,
All we actually have on this, that we can be certain of, are Anderson"s assertions in Blackwoods Magazine and his autobiography of 1910.
Now its extraordinary that Major Henry Smith,a prominent City Police Chief himself, both during the Ripper scare and later , together with the Editor of the Jewish Chronicle state that he is talking poppycock and that nobody knew who the Ripper was.
We also have Winston Churchill taking strong exception to several revelations Robert Anderson makes ,in this same Blackwoods Magazine.Churchill objects to the "inaccuracies" that run through his assertions,which he puts down to his" advancing years".He also objects to the spirit of "gross boastfulness"-and says that they are written in the style of ,"How Bill Adams won the Battle of Waterloo.----that he just wanted to show how important he was ,how invariably he was right etc etc "---in short Churchill read Anderson"s words and had little time for him or his assertions.


This being the case we need to see whether anything the doctors who admitted him to Colney Hatch and Leavesdon have to say about Aaron Kosminski's illness.
The first record we have is by M.Whitfield on 12 July 1890.The reason given is "query insane".It wasnt serious because he was released three days later.

The second record we have is from 4 February 1891.M,Whitfield is again the admissions officer.Three days later Aaron is transferred to Colney Hatch.

THere are in fact two records for Colney Hatch with slightly different wording.
The "record of admissions" states that he has been 6 years insane [-in the second record there is an alteration from 6 months to 6 years.]


Interestingly the record of admissions states his symptoms are "incoherence"----the cause- "self abuse"

However the second record from the male patients day book states that the cause is "unknown" and then it says in red "self abuse".

the form then has an entry :

DANGEROUS TO OTHERS -:NO

and it states he is not suicidal.

A later doctor"s report refers to him having "aural hallucinations".

At one point in his 30 year incarceration he took up a chair and attempted to strike a charge attendent- 9 Jan 1892 but by Nov 17 1892 the notes state that Aaron is quiet and well behaved--- but only speaks German now-[probably Yiddish].

Aaron is noted also as being able to Read and Write.

The notes describe a few episodes of chronic mania from 1892 onwards but at no point do they retract from their original statement made on admission that Aaron Kosminski was NOT a danger to others.

His condition as he settled into institutional life deteriorated to what was described as "dementia".


Now none of these Hospital and Hospital Doctor"s notes support Anderson"s allegation that Aaron Kosminski had ever had been a "danger to others"---still less had been revelling in blood and was actually Jack the Ripper.

And I believe they would have done,had Aaron Kosminski ever been a danger to others ------which clearly Jack the Ripper was.
Best Wishes
Norma

[Bailey]

Mr Evans,

I'd like to add my voice of appreciation to your contributions to this and other threads, including the assorted scans and whatnot, which are interesting in and of their own right, even if they are not always strictly on topic (not a criticism - I see why you would think of posting the cutting service scan in this context. I can also see how it is slightly off-topic, but not so much so as to earn a "reprimand" as it did).

The last few days since Mr Fido turned up have resulted in some very exciting times on the forums (again, not to suggest that things are dull without him - I so often feel like I'm walking on eggshells around here!) and I have enjoyed it greatly. I should therefore certainly hope that things continue as they have been and that none of these personality conflicts spoil that or restrict us from moving ahead. I shall say nothing bad about anyone at this point, but suggest that some parties are perhaps justified in feeling ill towards other parties, and sometimes vice versa. It would, however, be a pity if valuable contributions were to be lost in the future, and perhaps we should all carefully consider that.

Cheers,
Bailey

[robhouse]

Natalie,

You said:

"NO,it most definitely is not consistent with anything currently known about Aaron Kosminski.
There is no evidence that Aaron Kosminski was violent,throughout the entire 30 years he was held in an asylum.
There is no evidence that he liked to "revel in blood" either."

Let's focus on one thing at a time, and talk about what is known about Anderson (not Kozminski).

1. It is known that Anderson believed that a Polish Jew was the Ripper. (This Polish Jew = Kozminski, ie. Aaron Kozminski... I dont think we need to get sidetracked by going into the chain that leads to this conclusion, although I am well aware people debate this).

2. We do not know when Anderson came to this conclusion, but if Swanson is to be believed it was prior to Kozminski's admission to Colney Hatch in Feb 1891.

3. In 1892, Anderson wrote "It is impossible to believe [the murders] were acts of a sane man - they were those of a maniac reveling in blood."

Aaron was a maniac. Anderson believed Aaron was the Ripper. Hence the statement "The murders were... those of a maniac (Kozminski) reveling in blood (Ripper)."

Whether "revelling in blood" is consistent with Kozminski is unknown (point taken, Macnaghten aside). But since in Anderson's mind, Kozminski and the Ripper were one and the same, the statement is consistent with Anderson's belief.

I do not see why this is such a problem.

Robert House

[Natalie Severn]

I too have found Stewart"s press cuttings very instructive and helpful.

[Cap'n Jack]

I had been enjoying this exchange as well, in particular the many new snippets being posted by Stewart, which do add to and perhaps alter our view of Anderson... but I have to say I have always viewed Anderson with a great deal of suspicion after I discovered the story of his alleged indecency in a railway carriage. I believe this story had been known to a select few before I found it, but it had certainly never seen the light of day in any publication as far as I can tell.
Now I wonder why an author who claimed to have a better understanding and grasp of a complicated character, like Anderson, would fail to include such vital detail as Anderson's detention for an offence of indecency in the earlier part of his career?
Akin to writing a biography of Sir Winston Churchill, and not mentioning the Second World War?

[Stewart P Evans]

Break

Stewart this is completely unfair. I have nothing against you personally I very much admire you, your posts and your work. I have simply been questioning some of your views on Anderson…..that’s all.
If you have taken offence then I apologise. It certainly wasn’t intended.
I shall take a break if it keeps you happy
Pirate

I am not in the habit of censoring anyone. You carry on and I'll take a break - I need it.

[Jeff Leahy]

Stewart this is completely unfair. I have nothing against you personally I very much admire you, your posts and your work. I have simply been questioning some of your views on Anderson…..that’s all.

If you have taken offence then I apologise. It certainly wasn’t intended.

I shall take a break if it keeps you happy

Pirate

[Stewart P Evans]

Thanks

Hi Stewart,
Thanks for the Press Cuttings Agency scan. Fascinating.
Nil Carborundum Illegitimus.
Regards,
Simon

Thanks very much for that Simon, I'm glad that someone appreciated it.

I have a ton of material and I am happy to share some of it with others. However, it appears that there is an element that would prefer that I didn't. I need to re-think what I am doing.

[Jeff Leahy]

What a prat you are. I wasn't suggesting anything by this, I just think that it is interesting and tells us that Anderson would be aware of all the press reports.

Then perhaps you should have said that in the first place....and again why are you firing all this personal abuse at me? I have not called you any names.

haven't invited anyone to speculate and I don't make it a habit to call people names - apart from ones who annoy me intensely. Anderson was quite right to subscribe to this service, I would do the same if I was doing his job. It's the last time I scan and post anything more on here.

Perhaps we should both cool off for a while. I will leave you in peace.

Pirate

[Simon Wood]

Hi Stewart,

Thanks for the Press Cuttings Agency scan. Fascinating.

Nil Carborundum Illegitimus.

Regards,

Simon

[Stewart P Evans]

Prat

Why is this interesting?
You are again inviting people to SPECULATE, and when they do so, you start calling them names.
Perhaps he was just collecting information.

What a prat you are. I wasn't suggesting anything by this, I just think that it is interesting and tells us that Anderson would be aware of all the press reports.

I haven't invited anyone to speculate and I don't make it a habit to call people names - apart from ones who annoy me intensely. Anderson was quite right to subscribe to this service, I would do the same if I was doing his job. It's the last time I scan and post anything more on here.

[Jeff Leahy]

I don't recall if I have posted this before or not, but Anderson subscribed to a press cutting service, they scoured all the papers and sent any mention of his name in the newspapers to him. Interesting, I thought -

[ATTACH]3530[/ATTACH]

Why is this interesting?

You are again inviting people to SPECULATE, and when they do so, you start calling them names.

Perhaps he was just collecting information.