JtR was Law Enforcement Hypothesis

[Batman]

https://i.pinimg.com/564x/0e/b0/49/0...53920ea625.jpg

Constable 1870 Met police holding a sword. So apparently, cutlasses/swords were used by city police or is this artist totally lost? I see some black and white photos of other policemen around England with them though. Was it just a decorative piece? They seem to train with it.

At what stage did the met stop carrying them around, if they ever did that is?

[Wickerman]

Constables never carried a sword on regular duty at the time of the murders.

[Wickerman]

A well researched source for the typical beat constable's equipment, called "appointments", can be found in, Capturing Jack the Ripper, by Neil Bell (Monty), in a chapter entitled Blue Bottles.
Here are listed items like the truncheon, whistle, handcuffs, pencil, notebook, bulls-eye lamp, and even the helmet, cape, boots, etc.

No weapons.

[Simon Wood]

Policemen carried a whistle, a whistle which, in Bucks Row, PC Neil refrained from blowing.

I wonder why he didn't want to alert the local populace to a murder.

[Batman]

Police training with swords.

It seems at least this sword was withdrawn from public use in 1887.

I am looking at this stuff from this website...
http://www.oldpolicecellsmuseum.org..../police_swords

It says some officers had them on ceremonial occasions. Now that would interest us a bit for say Mayor's Day or something on the Bank Holidays.

They even seem to do it today but is connected with rank. Seems it was back then too. https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...ted_Police.JPG

http://gmic.co.uk/topic/35875-victor...-police-sword/
This says...

P.C. in 1870 - carrying this pattern of sword. Each Station had it's own armoury of swords and pistols. These could be issued when required, or, when asked for by the constable - the station sgt. or, duty officer was responsible. It is not generally known that as late as the 1930's a constable could request a firearm if patrolling a very dangerous beat.

It seems Leicestershire Police Force withdrew the sword in 1867.

I think rather than focusing on what was standard police issue let's say in Whitechapel 1888, how an officer would have such a sword in certain situations for a reason. It seems soldiers on some Bank Holidays could carry theirs around.

[Sam Flynn]

Policemen carried a whistle, a whistle which, in Bucks Row, PC Neil refrained from blowing.

Because another officer had arrived there already?

[Monty]

Whistles were only to be used in an emergency.

Unfortunately Nichols was already deceased. Therefore no need to whistle.

It’s all in my book.

Monty

[Monty]

Policemen carried a whistle, a whistle which, in Bucks Row, PC Neil refrained from blowing.

I wonder why he didn't want to alert the local populace to a murder.

Because controlling a local populace at the scene would require a resource better established elsewhere.

Monty

[Monty]

Police training with swords.

It seems at least this sword was withdrawn from public use in 1887.

I am looking at this stuff from this website...
http://www.oldpolicecellsmuseum.org..../police_swords

It says some officers had them on ceremonial occasions. Now that would interest us a bit for say Mayor's Day or something on the Bank Holidays.

They even seem to do it today but is connected with rank. Seems it was back then too. https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...ted_Police.JPG

http://gmic.co.uk/topic/35875-victor...-police-sword/
This says...

P.C. in 1870 - carrying this pattern of sword. Each Station had it's own armoury of swords and pistols. These could be issued when required, or, when asked for by the constable - the station sgt. or, duty officer was responsible. It is not generally known that as late as the 1930's a constable could request a firearm if patrolling a very dangerous beat.

It seems Leicestershire Police Force withdrew the sword in 1867.

I think rather than focusing on what was standard police issue let's say in Whitechapel 1888, how an officer would have such a sword in certain situations for a reason. It seems soldiers on some Bank Holidays could carry theirs around.

Cutlass use was ceased in the 1860s, when they were deemed ineffectual against the Feniain uprising. They were retained under lock and key, for use once the riot act had been read.

Senior officers can wear a cutlass or sword on ceremonial duties only.

Monty

[Batman]

Cutlass use was ceased in the 1860s, when they were deemed ineffectual against the Feniain uprising. They were retained under lock and key, for use once the riot act had been read.

Senior officers can wear a cutlass or sword on ceremonial duties only.

Monty

Thanks for that Monty.

[Batman]

Continuing on from here... https://forum.casebook.org/showthrea...t=11006&page=6

Ah, are you suggesting that he may have been fired prior to the murders but retained his uniform?

Otherwise I think a uniformed killer would have two major problems. Firstly, he risked getting blood and gore on his uniform, and he would surely have a problem explaining that to his sergeant on parade.

Secondly, if he was seen by a Whitechapel officer that officer would be aware that he was way off beat. He would therefore be attracting unwelcomed attention to himself (this would also apply if he was a former officer who retained his uniform), which he was presumably keen to avoid.

I suspect they bought their own uniforms and had them made to size and therefore could still own them.

I think JtR was extremely specific about not getting blood on himself and this was critical to his attacks, except for Kelly, where he had free reign of the home so to speak. This is evidence I have for this here. https://forum.casebook.org/showthread.php?t=10998

There are tons of reasons for him to be off his beat and one of them is helping out looking for the ripper. He could be going home, going to work or claim he has been sent on a task.

Best of all, he may have inside knowledge of not just police beats, but stakeouts and would know who the plainclothed officers were.

[MrBarnett]

Continuing on from here... https://forum.casebook.org/showthrea...t=11006&page=6



I suspect they bought their own uniforms and had them made to size and therefore could still own them.

I think JtR was extremely specific about not getting blood on himself and this was critical to his attacks, except for Kelly, where he had free reign of the home so to speak. This is evidence I have for this here. https://forum.casebook.org/showthread.php?t=10998

There are tons of reasons for him to be off his beat and one of them is helping out looking for the ripper. He could be going home, going to work or claim he has been sent on a task.

Best of all, he may have inside knowledge of not just police beats, but stakeouts and would know who the plainclothed officers were.

So you think a Victorian PC had his own personal tailor?

[Batman]

So you think a Victorian PC had his own personal tailor?

I would think much like today there would be an outlet that specialized in work uniforms. Clergy, nurses, doctors, police, judges, etc. Why, do you know they were given uniforms that they had on hand?

[MrBarnett]

I would think much like today there would be an outlet that specialized in work uniforms. Clergy, nurses, doctors, police, judges, etc. Why, do you know they were given uniforms that they had on hand?

Why would you think that? Are you UK based?

[Batman]

Why would you think that? Are you UK based?

So the answer is you don't know for now? I am waiting for your source that doubts it.