The Truth; part 1

[Rosella]

I would like to read the list, GUT, if you would like to post it. Very interesting! In those days of large families children were often spread over a 15-20 year period.

I would also like to hear from Amanda please, about Mary and her Welsh mining husband, John.

[Amanda]

Certainly....

I would like to read the list, GUT, if you would like to post it. Very interesting! In those days of large families children were often spread over a 15-20 year period.

I would also like to hear from Amanda please, about Mary and her Welsh mining husband, John.

Hi Rosella,

Well, pretty much put what I'd found on the other post.

Mary and John boarded with a family near the mines in Llanelly.
John is shown as being 28 years old and born in Scotland.
Mary is 19 and born in Carmarthenshire, but further digging I found her Irish father.
I would guess that some time after John's death she moved to London.

I'm off to Poland tomorrow, but will dedicate some serious time to tracking this Mary when I get back next week. Don't want to get any hopes up until I'm sure it's the right girl
Amanda

[pinkmoon]

Hi Rosella,

Well, pretty much put what I'd found on the other post.

Mary and John boarded with a family near the mines in Llanelly.
John is shown as being 28 years old and born in Scotland.
Mary is 19 and born in Carmarthenshire, but further digging I found her Irish father.
I would guess that some time after John's death she moved to London.

I'm off to Poland tomorrow, but will dedicate some serious time to tracking this Mary when I get back next week. Don't want to get any hopes up until I'm sure it's the right girl
Amanda

Hi Amanda,have you ever thought about checking magistrate records to see if a Mary Kelly was ever arrested for prostitution or for good old fashioned drunken disorderly.

[Amanda]

Nope...

Hi Amanda,have you ever thought about checking magistrate records to see if a Mary Kelly was ever arrested for prostitution or for good old fashioned drunken disorderly.

Hello Pinkmoon,

Don't pass the buck! I'm off to Poland for a few days, so will leave you to search the magistrate records.....

If you don't find anything by the end of next week, I'll join forces with you.

I'm wondering if one of MJK's siblings was already living in London & that's why she chose to go there. Secure roof over her head etc..

Amanda

[GUT]

G'day Rosella

Age at birth of
last child was.........First child..........No. Kids

37.........................20..................... 8
27.........................27..................... 2 [Twins]
44.........................17..................... 12
24.........................20..................... .2 [2nd dies 2 days after birth]
35.........................16..................... 12
45.........................36..................... .5 [believe she was married before kids there unknown]
44.........................22..................... .5
42.........................15..................... .16
40.........................22..................... .9
38.........................24..................... .7
22.........................20..................... .3

A couple of points though these are only the ones that I am pretty confident I have full details for save there may be still births I don't have as noted above the one with first child at 36 was I believe married before and may have had children.

The most children I can find in my family after 1700 was 21 in 18 years [hey should have buried her standing up as she must have spent almost all her life on her back, I joke that she porably died of exhaustion].

Also I should perhaps add that of the 11 one was in NZ, 3 in UK and 7 in Australia which may have some impact.

Also because of the spread of children and range of ages you get some strange family combinations, I have about 4 examples of an Uncle and his niece / Aunty and Nephew, marrying Brother and Sister

[pinkmoon]

Hello Pinkmoon,

Don't pass the buck! I'm off to Poland for a few days, so will leave you to search the magistrate records.....

If you don't find anything by the end of next week, I'll join forces with you.

I'm wondering if one of MJK's siblings was already living in London & that's why she chose to go there. Secure roof over her head etc..

Amanda

Hi Amanda,I have a feeling that Mary Kelly might well be a false name I don't think anyone will ever be able to trace her origins.

[MayBea]

Who would change their name to Mary Jane?

Do you really think someone like Kelly would have picked the name Mary Jane out of all the possibilities?

Do you really think she would have changed her name to Marie Jeanette if her name wasn't really Mary Jane?

Do you really think she would have changed her name to Marie Jeanette and then put or left the common name Kelly there as a clunker at the end?

[miss marple]

Oh dear,I dont want to burst Amanda's balloon and in fact she might have found Mary but- there are a few issues.

I have crawling around the Welsh Davies's for years and there are hundreds, so to consider Amanda's census entry of 1881.
John Davies 28 born in Scotland working at the Millwright Tin Works Llanelly.Carmarthanshire residing at 17 Dolan Row. He is down as single, not married.

Also residing at 17 Dolan Row was Mary Jane Davies 19, born Carmarthan,
single, a domestic servant.

Now as Davies was the commonest name in Wales, two unrelated Davies living in the same house was not unknown. There was a Mary Jane Davies born in Llanelly in 1863.
I have found no record of marriage that fits these two. I believe she was born a Davies. That does not mean she did not have a relationship with him.

Anyway I hope Amanda has some more info.

Miss Marple

Regarding the age of victorian women giving birth, my great grandmother born 1869 had ten chidren over a 22 year period, the last at age 45. From my research in the records, there were many older mothers and older women marrying younger men.

[Amanda]

Working on it...

Hi Miss Marple,

I have quite a bit of info but need to double check it all.

I have a different address for these two, so will look closely at the records.
Might be a needle in a haystack....

Amanda

[MayBea]

Mary Jane [Kelly] dau 9 Soldiers child 1862 IrelandThe Royal Marine Barracks, Portsea, Hampshire.

I think this might be her married in 1878 and still married in 1911.

Marriages Mar 1878
KELLY Mary Jane Isle Of Wight
LAMBERT Alfred Isle Of Wight

1911 England Census▼▼▼

Name: Mary Jane Lambert
Spouse: Alfred James Lambert
Birth: abt 1863 - Dublin, Ireland
Marriage: year
Residence: date - city, Hampshire, England