PC Long, GSG & a Piece of Apron

[El White Chap]

It was a "womb", if I recall, not the kidney.



So you choose to believe this killer opened up the abdomen, detached & lifted out the intestines, but did not remove the kidney or the uterus?


I wouldn't confine yourself to the stated times (which you posted previously), the couple seen by Lawende may not have been the victim & killer afterall. There's no certainty attached to that assumption.
The killer may have already been in Mitre Square with Eddowes when Lawende & Co. exited the Club, thereby rendering the assumed time window useless.

Some good sense here.

The timeline presented is not completely reliable or accurate as we cannot be sure on the exacts of events.

Some could learn to keep an open mind on such things instead of blabbering tosh in order to "establish" a sequence which suits their theories.

Evidence is open to interpretation.

[Wickerman]

Dr Brown later wanted to test this time period and asked a colleague to remove a kidney in similar circumstances and I understand that failed.

It was a "womb", if I recall, not the kidney.

But lets look at it in a different light taking away the organ removal from the crime scene, then yes the killer probably could have done all of that in 5 mins.

So you choose to believe this killer opened up the abdomen, detached & lifted out the intestines, but did not remove the kidney or the uterus?


I wouldn't confine yourself to the stated times (which you posted previously), the couple seen by Lawende may not have been the victim & killer afterall. There's no certainty attached to that assumption.
The killer may have already been in Mitre Square with Eddowes when Lawende & Co. exited the Club, thereby rendering the assumed time window useless.

[Trevor Marriott]

Sutcliffe is one of the best examples for our understanding of the Whitechapel murderer.

Why ?

According to Dr. Brown he did.
Plus, the evidence speaks for itself.

"At least 5 mins he says" Modern day experts now question that time period.

I would be the first to concede that a modern day skilled surgeon could probably remove a uterus and kidney in under 5 mins.

But 126 years ago how many skilled surgeons went around killing women and removing organs

Dr Brown later wanted to test this time period and asked a colleague to remove a kidney in similar circumstances and I understand that failed.

But lets look at it in a different light taking away the organ removal from the crime scene, then yes the killer probably could have done all of that in 5 mins.

First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.
Mahatma Gandhi (1869-1948)

[Trevor Marriott]

Yes, Trevor. I agree with all of those things ( I would say very thin rather than emaciated perhaps, emaciated is something I always associated with the skeletal like features in , for example, famine victims, anorexics etc.,with severe muscle loss as well as fat loss but I suppose I must be wrong and it must cover just being thin too from the amount of people who describe Kate as such )

I've said so many times on other forums and threads, I've argued that Eddowes could still have been menstruating against a few people. That shows how much attention you pay to points being made doesn't it?
So, What is the relevance to my original question then?

Your expert was given a description of the apron piece blood marks to make conclusions about whether they could have been caused by it being used as a menstrual napkin. What official description of the apron piece and its blood stain etc. was he given? I'm curious.

The description of the apron piece as you know differs from spotted with blood to staining to being smeared. As he said he cannot give a definite answer because the original piece he was not able to see the piece or a photo of the piece.

He simply gave his professional opinion based on what he was told.

I don't know where you stand with this GS piece do you rule out her using it to wipe herself after servicing a client. or using it as a sanitary device ? or do you subscribe to the knife or hand wiping theory, or the fact he might have cut himself. Pick one and lets discuss it more if that's what you want to do.

As I said before there is no definite answer but with the evidence to hand some of the above are less likely. You pays you money and you takes your choice.

First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.
Mahatma Gandhi (1869-1948)

[Debra A]

Lets stop playing cat and mouse here let me ask you some simple and straight questions regarding what the expert has commented on bearing in mind he is a consultant gynecologist not a ripperologist

1. Do you accept that Eddowes was malnourished and emanciated ?

2. Do you accept that at her age she could still be menstruating ?

3. Do you accept that spotting and smearing are both consistent with the
menstrual process ?

4. Do you accept the experts comments and observations re the above ?

Yes, Trevor. I agree with all of those things ( I would say very thin rather than emaciated perhaps, emaciated is something I always associated with the skeletal like features in , for example, famine victims, anorexics etc.,with severe muscle loss as well as fat loss but I suppose I must be wrong and it must cover just being thin too from the amount of people who describe Kate as such )

I've said so many times on other forums and threads, I've argued that Eddowes could still have been menstruating against a few people. That shows how much attention you pay to points being made doesn't it?
So, What is the relevance to my original question then?

Your expert was given a description of the apron piece blood marks to make conclusions about whether they could have been caused by it being used as a menstrual napkin. What official description of the apron piece and its blood stain etc. was he given? I'm curious.

[Wickerman]

Sutcliffe is not a very good analogy

Sutcliffe is one of the best examples for our understanding of the Whitechapel murderer.

Did the killer have time to show his artistic side in Mitre Square ?

According to Dr. Brown he did.
Plus, the evidence speaks for itself.

[Debra A]

and the relevance of that question is ?

I think you know full well the answer to your own question, that's why you won't answer it.

[The Good Michael]

Not even putting a stop and the end of a sentence is just laziness.

I disagree. I think it's a form of madness complete with twitching and frothing at the mouth; all very understandable in this case.

Mike

[Hunter]

There is thing nowadays where the evidence in old unsolved cases is reviewed its called "A Cold Case Investigation" which is what I have done reviewed the old previously accepted facts and finding out that what has previously been accepted may not be the case.

There is also "a" thing nowadays called an English grammar book. Instead of spending so much time here showing your illiteracy, you (and another or two) might want to review one of those instead. Not even putting a stop and the end of a sentence is just laziness.

[El White Chap]

Wrong again !
I next came in at 1.44am and turned to the right ! from official inquest testimony

Now why don't you stop making a ---- out of yourself

First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.
Mahatma Gandhi (1869-1948)

PC Watkins had Greenwich Mean Time on his Casio?

It's you who is making the utter pillock of themselves here.

[Trevor Marriott]

I never said they were wrong, only you used that word. I said they were approximate and that is a very different thing. You must be more careful in how you comprehend and decipher others opinions as you've often got the wrong idea from other posters.

The official reports state:

Approx 1:45 PM: PC Edward Watkins discovers Eddowes' body in Mitre Square.

Now lets go through that statement together shall we? The very first word is...?

Wrong again !
I next came in at 1.44am and turned to the right ! from official inquest testimony

Now why don't you stop making a ---- out of yourself

First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.
Mahatma Gandhi (1869-1948)

[El White Chap]

Oh so you think all of those timings are wrong do you? well please explain your take on the timings then, on how and when she was murdered ? I am sure all on here wait with baited breath.

First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.
Mahatma Gandhi (1869-1948)

I never said they were wrong, only you used that word. I said they were approximate and that is a very different thing. You must be more careful in how you comprehend and decipher others opinions as you've often got the wrong idea from other posters.

The official reports state:

Approx 1:45 AM: PC Edward Watkins discovers Eddowes' body in Mitre Square.

Now lets go through that statement together shall we? The very first word is...?

[El White Chap]

Lets stop playing cat and mouse here let me ask you some simple and straight questions

Simple and straight questions from you?

Your questions have absolutely nothing to do with what I was discussing about before. Talk about going off on a tangent jeeeeeeez

[Trevor Marriott]

Well done Marriott, you've exceeded yourself by posting the timings we already have!

FYI there was no GMT back then, thus no synced timings, thus no exact timeframe to the minute for Eddowes murder.

Despite your apparent "wealth" of knowledge it is you who displays on a daily basis such a degree of naivety and delusion that it keeps us all entertained.

Oh so you think all of those timings are wrong do you? well please explain your take on the timings then, on how and when she was murdered ? I am sure all on here wait with baited breath.

First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.
Mahatma Gandhi (1869-1948)

[El White Chap]

Just out of interest, I'm rather intrigued as to why you often leave a space between the last word of your sentence and your regular featuring exclamation mark?

Rather odd and quirky much like yourself.