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Go Back   Casebook Forums > Ripper Discussions > Suspects > Druitt, Montague John

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  #1  
Old 05-06-2008, 03:08 PM
Natalie Severn Natalie Severn is offline
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Default Sidney Ball and Barnett House ,Whitechapel-a Druitt contemporary

Sidney Ball was one of the very first Oxford students to offer his services to Rev Barnett in 1875 while still a student.I am not at this stage certain whether he was an undergraduate at New College[Druitt"s college] or Barnett"s college Wadham.
I quote from Canon Barnett"s" Life and Work" bk 1 page 308:
"After they graduated some of the men who had visited us [from Oxford colleges-which included New College Oxford ie Druitt"s college]came to reside in the EAST LONDON.
They lived together in twos and threes in lodgings or in the model dwellings.*
One group of five took a disused beer-shop in Leman Street**-where they established a delightful bachelor household and termed it "The Friary".They themselves often went back to Oxford to recruit for the East End work."...........
I understand from the records that ET Cook,Druitt"s school , college and debating colleague ,and a very early volunteer service worker at Toynbee Hall, resided in Blackheath after coming down from Oxford in 1881.He had family in Blackheath

" ......much fresh interest was rewakened-new recruits gathered around Arnold Toynbee-[ET Cook,from New College being one we know of for certain].
But it was to Mr Sidney Ball,whose alert mind wide sympathies,powers of organisation and fervent practical idealism made him then,as ever since, a strong force for progress....."
.......it was his discernment,which discovered powers in undergraduates that could be put to public uses.It was his energy that organised innumerable meetings,among them a memorable one at the Union ,when the abolition of the poor law was debated,march 8th 1877.And therefore it naturally followed that it was in his rooms that the meeting was held on November 17th 1883,when Toynbee Hall was born.It was he who founded in 1913....... Barnett House for the advancement of "economics and social studies"........of the work of University Settlements [such as had been started at Toynbee Hall]".
GR Sims apparently helped in these extended initiatives by his writings on "How the Poor Live"-as did a Mr Henry George and Mr Mearns" tract on "The Bittter Cry of Outcast London".
Below is a picture of Barnett House as it is today.It is very close to where the Crispin Street Refuge stands but in Bell Street which is a continuation of Crispin Street.


*such as those in Goulston Street Street where the graffiti was found.
** Mary Kelly"s old patch[allegedly].
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Last edited by Natalie Severn : 05-06-2008 at 03:14 PM.
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  #2  
Old 05-06-2008, 06:55 PM
aspallek aspallek is offline
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Hi Nats,

Could the #3 entry here from the 1881 census be our man?

1. Name Mary A. BALL Relationship Head Condition W Gender F Age 58 Occupation Private Income Birthplace Chester, Cheshire, England Address 25 Stanley Crest, London, Middlesex, England PRO ref RG11/0029 Folio 126 Page 47 FHL film no. 1341006
Amount paid 0.00

2. Name Edwin F. BALL Relationship Son Condition U Gender M Age 25 Occupation Barrister No Practice Yet B.A. Cambridge Birthplace Pershore, Worcester, England Address 25 Stanley Crest, London, Middlesex, England PRO ref RG11/0029 Folio 126 Page 47 FHL film no. 1341006
Amount paid 0.00

3. Name Sydney BALL Relationship Son Condition U Gender M Age 23 Occupation Student Ret Oxford (Not Sch) Birthplace Pershore, Worcester, England Address 25 Stanley Crest, London, Middlesex, England PRO ref RG11/0029 Folio 126 Page 47 FHL film no. 1341006
Amount paid 0.00

4. Name Henry B. BALL Relationship Son Condition U Gender M Age 22 Occupation Clerk On Stock Exchange Birthplace Pershore, Worcester, England Address 25 Stanley Crest, London, Middlesex, England PRO ref RG11/0029 Folio 126 Page 47 FHL film no. 1341006
Amount paid 0.00

5. Name Mary E. BALL Relationship Daur Condition U Gender F Age 21 Occupation Birthplace Pershore, Worcester, England Address 25 Stanley Crest, London, Middlesex, England PRO ref RG11/0029 Folio 126 Page 47 FHL film no. 1341006
Amount paid 0.00

6. Name Gertrude BALL Relationship Daur Condition U Gender F Age 21 Occupation Birthplace Pershore, Worcester, England Address 25 Stanley Crest, London, Middlesex, England PRO ref RG11/0029 Folio 126 Page 47 FHL film no. 1341006
Amount paid 0.00

7. Name Minnie H. BALL Relationship Daur Condition U Gender F Age 19 Occupation Birthplace Pershore, Worcester, England Address 25 Stanley Crest, London, Middlesex, England PRO ref RG11/0029 Folio 126 Page 47 FHL film no. 1341006
Amount paid 0.00

8. Name Mary NORTON Relationship Serv Condition U Gender F Age 34 Occupation Cook Birthplace Labrington, York, England Address 25 Stanley Crest, London, Middlesex, England PRO ref RG11/0029 Folio 126 Page 47 FHL film no. 1341006
Amount paid 0.00

9. Name Louisa CARTER Relationship Serv Condition U Gender F Age 23 Occupation Waitress (...) Birthplace Swaffham, Norfolk, England Address 25 Stanley Crest, London, Middlesex, England PRO ref RG11/0029 Folio 126 Page 47 FHL film no. 1341006
Amount paid 0.00

10. Name Alice HAWES Relationship Serv Condition U Gender F Age 22 Occupation Housemaid Birthplace Lowestoft, Suffolk, England Address 25 Stanley Crest, London, Middlesex, England PRO ref RG11/0029 Folio 126 Page 47 FHL film no. 1341006
Amount paid 0.00
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Old 05-06-2008, 07:41 PM
Natalie Severn Natalie Severn is offline
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Hi Andy,
I think it might be him but in every reference it gives Sidney as spelt with an "I".However they often got spellings wrong in the census.I also can"t find a Stanley Crescent address in Middlesex,though here in Notting Hill [West london],there is a Stanley Crescent.Another clue turned up today in that Rev Barnett visited him in his rooms in "St John"s" in Oxford----so if that is another College of Oxford then thats where Sidney Ball studied-and not New College.I believe all the others I put down as being at New College were correct though as I have now had time to double check.

There does seem to have been a great interest by the clergy all over England in the work of Toynbee Hall and I wonder if this may also be where we may find a Druitt link.Although only some 100 odd students from Oxford and Cambridge took digs in Whitechapel to help with the work at Toynbee Hall it states in the books on its progress and development that it had "thousands of visitors" during the 1880"s and this turn over seems to have gone on quite some time into the first half of the twentieth century.The visitors are also from a reasonable cross section of the political spectrum as well with Stead,Sims and others celebrating its work in the press.The same happened with the clergy.One of Barnett"s great friends is a man named Rev.A S W Young from his student days ,who appears to have lived in Kingston.But there was also a well to do couple from "Blackheath",named Young,a Mr and Mrs Alexander Young who,via ET Cook it seems,also of Blackheath, lent some very precious masterpieces for the Toynbee Hall/Whitechapel Art Gallery,curated by ET Cook.THis was in 1893.It says Rev Barnett was met at Blackheath Station by Mr Young"s carriage.

As if that isnt enough of the great and the good, there was at least one Oxford student who became a future Archbishop of Canterbury ,to say nothing of the future politicians ,Chamberlain and Balfourto name but two of several,as well as one Royal who showed a keen interest in the work- HRH Duke of Clarence.The Aclands too seem to have been hugely helpful,particularly Arthur.

Norma

Last edited by Natalie Severn : 05-06-2008 at 07:46 PM.
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Old 05-06-2008, 07:49 PM
aspallek aspallek is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Natalie Severn View Post
There does seem to have been a great interest by the clergy all over England in the work of Toynbee Hall and I wonder if this may also be where we may find a Druitt link.
Yes, and one recalls the letters in the West Sussex Records Office from Jabez Druitt, an East End resident, to the sister of Rev. Charles Druitt.
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Old 05-06-2008, 08:10 PM
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Chris Scott Chris Scott is offline
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Hi Norma
Sidney Ball went to Wellington College and then Oriel College Oxford
Here is his entry from the list of Oxford Alumni
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Old 05-06-2008, 08:18 PM
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Chris Scott Chris Scott is offline
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Here is the announcement of his marriage
The Times 25 December 1891
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Old 05-06-2008, 08:31 PM
Natalie Severn Natalie Severn is offline
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Thanks Andy and Chris,
I dont know of that letter Andy.....?

Chris,
It looks like it is the Sydney Ball Andy posted doesnt it-with the Worcester link.
I used to live almost next door to Rock House in Ealing---its a small world!
Thanks for posting this information Chris.
Any link between the Alexander Young"s of Blackheath and the Rev.Young who was Barnett"s best friend?
Best
Norma
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Old 05-06-2008, 08:42 PM
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here is Ball's obituary

24 May 1918
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Old 05-06-2008, 08:45 PM
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here is a trubute to Ball and a report on his funeral
28 May 1918
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Old 05-06-2008, 08:49 PM
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Norma
Ir seems there was also a Barnett House in Oxford
The bit below is from 13 March 1919
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