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Go Back   Casebook Forums > Ripper Discussions > Suspects > Klosowski, Severin (George Chapman)

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  #11  
Old 06-17-2011, 07:11 PM
Errata Errata is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisGeorge View Post

Nonetheless, Adam, I see where you are coming from in favoring Chapman as a preferred suspect. He also did seem to have some type of fascination with weapons... cf. the curious photograph of him and Bessie Taylor below the upside down flags, swords and guns.

All the best

Chris
It always strikes me that if a guy takes the time and puts forth the effort to grow a cartoon villain mustache, that people should pay attention to that choice. It's why I never dated emo boys. If you are going to work that hard to seem depressed, uncaring, and uninteresting, I take your word for it.
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  #12  
Old 06-17-2011, 09:42 PM
ChrisGeorge ChrisGeorge is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Errata View Post
It always strikes me that if a guy takes the time and puts forth the effort to grow a cartoon villain mustache, that people should pay attention to that choice. It's why I never dated emo boys. If you are going to work that hard to seem depressed, uncaring, and uninteresting, I take your word for it.
I guess we need to be careful with Chapman. The cartoon villain moustache is one thing, that photograph is another, the reality of his poison crimes something else, but the fact that he never admitted that he murdered his poisoned "wives" might indicate that he had an interior life and an exterior life that were not one and the same. Besides which, how much is the moustache a period affectation?

Best regards

Chrsi
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  #13  
Old 06-17-2011, 10:16 PM
Natalie Severn Natalie Severn is offline
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I went to Cable Street on December 26th 2009 to see Fiona Shaw in a recital of The Wasteland at London's very old and beautiful East End theatre ,Wilton's.
Walking past where George Chapman had his barber shop in Cable Street this wasteland of a place next to railway arches and parallel to the river made me think of how easy it would have been for him living so close to the murders to commit both the Torso murder of Pinchin Street and the murders of the double event and make his escape from the latter and clean himself up quickly, undetected.Its about 10-12 minutes from Mitre Square and 3 minutes from where Dutfield Yard was in Berner Street and in those days ,as now, these streets were and are,not well lit.Walking past you see clearly how close he was to the railway arch in Pinchin Street where one of the torso murder victims were placed---sort of directly opposite his shop.This was in 1889 too a good six months after Mary Kelly's death and Chapman was living there alone.He didn't have his wife Lucy living with him there until he married her on October 29 1889.The shop had a basement too where he could have cut up bodies in secret.
I think he is a strong suspect who cannot be discounted.
Best,
Norma
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  #14  
Old 06-18-2011, 05:04 AM
Adam Went Adam Went is offline
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Chris/Errata:

A man who refuses to admit even to his own identity at the end is surely one who has a few skeletons in the closet - perhaps literally.

Nats:

Thanks for posting that up - haven't had the chance to go to Cable Street myself yet of course (or London at all for that matter), but judging from maps and descriptions it is definitely easy to see how he could have had easy and relatively quick access to all of the murder sites.

And we already know he was in Cable Street and therefore London in 1888, which just in itself is already a lot more than can be said for some "suspects"!

Cheers,
Adam.
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  #15  
Old 06-18-2011, 09:30 PM
Natalie Severn Natalie Severn is offline
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Its an amazing place is Cable Street.Not only for the time when the Fascists were booted out of the East End in the great battle of Cable Street [1937] but also because further up from where George Chapman lived---but not that much further up---it crosses Cannon St Road,the same cross road where the suspect for the famous Ratcliffe Highway murders is buried with a stake through his heart!
But yes, one spooky part of London !
Cheers Adam,
Norma
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  #16  
Old 06-19-2011, 07:00 AM
Adam Went Adam Went is offline
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Hey Nats,

Fascinating stuff. How far is it to Fleet Street and the infamous "other" demon barber?

Cheers,
Adam.
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  #17  
Old 06-19-2011, 05:29 PM
ChrisGeorge ChrisGeorge is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Adam Went View Post
Hey Nats,

Fascinating stuff. How far is it to Fleet Street and the infamous "other" demon barber?

Cheers,
Adam.
Hi Adam

You're probably talking only around two miles if you walked west from the East End into the old City. As to how long it would take to walk it, it would depend on how "fleet" you were.

All the best

Chris
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  #18  
Old 06-20-2011, 05:09 PM
Abby Normal Abby Normal is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Natalie Severn View Post
I went to Cable Street on December 26th 2009 to see Fiona Shaw in a recital of The Wasteland at London's very old and beautiful East End theatre ,Wilton's.
Walking past where George Chapman had his barber shop in Cable Street this wasteland of a place next to railway arches and parallel to the river made me think of how easy it would have been for him living so close to the murders to commit both the Torso murder of Pinchin Street and the murders of the double event and make his escape from the latter and clean himself up quickly, undetected.Its about 10-12 minutes from Mitre Square and 3 minutes from where Dutfield Yard was in Berner Street and in those days ,as now, these streets were and are,not well lit.Walking past you see clearly how close he was to the railway arch in Pinchin Street where one of the torso murder victims were placed---sort of directly opposite his shop.This was in 1889 too a good six months after Mary Kelly's death and Chapman was living there alone.He didn't have his wife Lucy living with him there until he married her on October 29 1889.The shop had a basement too where he could have cut up bodies in secret.
I think he is a strong suspect who cannot be discounted.
Best,
Norma
Thanks Norma
When were the dates he lived in cable street? Can anyone post a map of it pinpointing where he lived?
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  #19  
Old 06-20-2011, 05:10 PM
glyn glyn is offline
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Id suggest Chapman (without knowing him persobnally of course) would be quite capable of changing his method of killing.Why wouldnt he be?
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  #20  
Old 06-20-2011, 05:47 PM
Natalie Severn Natalie Severn is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Abby Normal View Post
Thanks Norma
When were the dates he lived in cable street? Can anyone post a map of it pinpointing where he lived?
Hi Abby,
In the Post Office Directory of 1889 he is down as being there in a barber shop of which he is the proprietor---he would have had a rental lease.In order to be entered in the Post Office Directory for the year 1889 he would have had to have been living in Cable Street [number 123 I think] at the time before.at latest 14 December 1888-though strictly speaking before 2nd December 1888.So he was running a barber shop there some time in the Autumn or early winter of 1888.He was also living there with his wife Lucy Baderski from the end of October 1889 when they married until some time in 1890.
Chris is right, Fleet Street and the barber shop of Sweeney Todd are about a mile and a half away--don't forget the City of London is a square mile and the EastEnd borders it,but Fleet Street is quite long and the barber shop of the demon barber was at the far end by the old church which still has the two statues of little men in the bell tower banging on its bells every hour.I think that church was old even then---two hundred years ago!!!! The pie shop vanished long ago along with the barber shop.One or two very old shops still stand but on the other side.
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