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Go Back   Casebook Forums > Ripper Discussions > Suspects > Maybrick, James

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  #3271  
Old 04-10-2017, 12:05 PM
John G John G is offline
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Originally Posted by caz View Post
I have finally found the time to address some of the posts made over the Christmas period, when I was having such trouble keeping up! Don't groan at the back there.



Not so fast…

Find fault with Feldman by all means [most of us can and have], but there is a danger of using his overenthusiastic but faulty reasoning to try and score points against the diary, which may be unwarranted. Find another error of Feldman's and bingo, it somehow morphs into a related error made by our hapless forger. But if the diary is being interpreted in the same way as Feldy did, and too much is being read into the words, or not enough, or the words are being changed to read something else, it may not be our diarist who was trying to be too clever.

As many probably know by now, I don't believe our hoaxer had to try that hard. I think he knew plenty about the Maybricks that we have since learned [Michael wrote lyrics as well as music, for example]; I suspect he had some inside info on the ripper (but only as good as whoever supplied it); he didn't need to practise with pen and ink if that was all he'd ever known; and he wouldn't have had to sweat the small stuff – like the speed of a horse race - or even some of the bigger stuff, like it not resembling Maybrick's handwriting - if it was only ever meant as a literary prank, or burlesque, to have some fun at the Maybricks' expense:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Burlesque



Before Harry got there, I was thinking to myself, hold on, don't racing people talk about the 'going' being fast or slow, depending on the state of the ground? Here's the man:





If the going was good, it could be said to have been 'fast'. But Harry went on to say:



So while the going could still have been slow due to the most recent spell of bad weather, despite a dramatic improvement on the day, that would not be comparing the going with the same race - the Grand National - in previous years. I wonder how many of them had been blessed with drier weather and firmer ground in the days leading up to the big event. This was after all early Spring in Liverpool, not July in the south of France.



Hold your horses…

It doesn't matter whether Maybrick wrote the diary or not. According to Feldman, he and his wife attended every Grand National after marrying and settling in Liverpool. So when he attended the race in 1889, as we know he did, he would arguably only have been able to compare the going with other years he could remember well from earlier that decade. If the going in those years had looked relatively poor due to worse weather on the day, he might well have got an impression in the Spring sunshine of 1889 of a faster race, without caring or needing to know the actual comparative speed of the horses.





Except that the author only said it was the fastest Grand National "Sir Jim" had seen – not the fastest 'in history'; not the fastest 'in living memory'; not the fastest 'ever'. If he is meant to have had a reasonable view of the action each year, he would certainly have noticed when the horses were labouring through saturated grass and churned up mud, or thundering past him on turf that was springy and ground that was dry and firm. Isn't that much more likely to have been something the real James could have compared as a regular race goer, without having to know the ins and outs of a flea's bottom?

Ooh, that was rather timely, wasn't it? Grand National time is with us again - in more ways than one.

Have a great weekend all.

Love,

Caz
X
Hi Caz,

I lost on the Grand National sweepstake!

Yes, I've just been looking at Harrison's book and the author of the diary writes: " ...true the race was the fastest I have seen..."

Interestingly, Frigate won that year. According to Harrison "That particular National, won by Frigate, was the fastest on record-information that has been confirmed after a great deal of probing in the race archives and local papers."

Well, actually, not enough "probing" it turns out, because it wasn't the fastest race on record as Frigate won in 10m 1.2 s, whereas several races had been won in under 10 minutes, i.e. The Lamb in 1871, 9m 35.7s.

Pity Wiki wasn't available when Shirley wrote her book! https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List...tional_winners

Fastest time ever? Mr Frisk, 1990, at an incredible 8m 47.8s.

Last edited by John G : 04-10-2017 at 12:19 PM.
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  #3272  
Old 04-10-2017, 12:32 PM
pinkmoon pinkmoon is offline
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Diary was written just before it was discovered of that I have absolutely no doubt .
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  #3273  
Old 04-11-2017, 12:11 AM
StevenOwl StevenOwl is offline
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Diary was written just before it was discovered of that I have absolutely no doubt .
Yes, you keep saying that, and yet as far as I can see you've never produced a single shred of evidence to back it up.
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  #3274  
Old 04-11-2017, 03:12 AM
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caz caz is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John G View Post
Hi Caz,

I lost on the Grand National sweepstake!

Yes, I've just been looking at Harrison's book and the author of the diary writes: " ...true the race was the fastest I have seen..."

Interestingly, Frigate won that year. According to Harrison "That particular National, won by Frigate, was the fastest on record-information that has been confirmed after a great deal of probing in the race archives and local papers."

Well, actually, not enough "probing" it turns out, because it wasn't the fastest race on record as Frigate won in 10m 1.2 s, whereas several races had been won in under 10 minutes, i.e. The Lamb in 1871, 9m 35.7s.

Pity Wiki wasn't available when Shirley wrote her book! https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List...tional_winners

Fastest time ever? Mr Frisk, 1990, at an incredible 8m 47.8s.
Hi John,

Thanks for that.

I won 5 off my other half! Mind you, we only sat down about an hour before the big race and our sweepstake consisted of dividing the 40 horses randomly between us and putting 25 each in the kitty, with the winner getting 20, runner up 15, third place 10 and fourth place 5. I had One for Arthur and Saint Are, and hubby had Cause of Causes and Blaklion.

Love,

Caz
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  #3275  
Old 04-11-2017, 03:16 AM
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caz caz is offline
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Originally Posted by pinkmoon View Post
Diary was written just before it was discovered of that I have absolutely no doubt .
Hi pinky,

I wouldn't put money on it if I were you.

Love,

Caz
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