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Go Back   Casebook Forums > Ripper Discussions > Victims > Elizabeth Stride

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  #51  
Old 02-16-2016, 10:26 AM
John G John G is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joshua Rogan View Post
An indication of how much (or how little) effort Keppel put into the report can be seen in the first paragraph about Annie Chapman, where he clearly confuses her murder with Polly's. Whilst not immediately negating all his conclusions, it doesn't fill you with confidence if he can't even get the details of the crimes correct.
I've just checked, and your're absolutely correct. Absolutely hilarious! I'm starting to loose faith in Keppel; this doesn't seem to have been a project that he was entirely committed to.
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  #52  
Old 02-17-2016, 12:49 AM
Mirandola Mirandola is offline
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Yes, a paragraph has been misplaced by Keppel et. al. at the beginning of the Chapman account, and not picked up; and though the passage is dismissed as a conflicting account, there must be a suggestion of less than full engagement with the actual series of murders (there's also a confusion where the Table on p. 3 is introduced 'The 11 Whitechapel murders examined in this paper occurred over a 10-month span', while the table itself includes cases from April 1888 to February 1891).
These are unfortunate lapses, since the analyses by Keppel and his colleagues of the MO and signature evidence certainly do produce a consistent outline of 'the Ripper' (which is unaffected by the lapses noted above) and document how very rare that particular constellation of elements is, at least in the database analysed.
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  #53  
Old 04-15-2017, 03:23 PM
Vincenzo Vincenzo is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by c.d. View Post
"If mutilation was the key, why would the killer attack his victim next to a busy social club?"

Hello Harry,

You can also turn that around and ask why anybody would kill in that location. If the location was bad for Jack it was also bad for a non-Jack killer.

c.d.
I always thought it was possible that Stride refused an offer from her killer togo to a more discreet location and the murderer lost his cool and attacked her on the spot.

If it was indeed JtR (and I believe it was) then it is very possible that he had no concern for location while in the moment.
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  #54  
Old 04-16-2017, 10:10 AM
Michael W Richards Michael W Richards is offline
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Originally Posted by Harry D View Post
All we have are two women that are murdered within an hour of each other. Both of them have their throats cut but aside than that there is no evidence that the two murders are related. The only evidence that links them is a letter written by someone claiming to be the killer, which is mainly considered a hoax by most authorities on the subject.
If only this could be the baseline, but for many, its still just a boogeyman hunt.
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  #55  
Old 04-18-2017, 10:05 AM
John Wheat John Wheat is offline
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Originally Posted by Harry D View Post
The murder of Elizabeth Stride has long been considered the odd one out of the 'canonical five' murders. Down the years she has been ruled in and out by numerous Ripper authors and amateur sleuths but the consensus seems to be that she was probably a victim of the serial killer known as 'Jack the Ripper'.

The question is why?

Stride's throat was cut less than an hour before a Ripper-esque murder. Sure, the timing is convenient, but life is full of strange coincidences. The Ripper case certainly isn't an exception to happenstance, e.g. Eddowes giving the same name to the police as the next victim, and Sarah Brown having her throat cut in a domestic on the night of the Double Event.

The lack of mutilations. These are largely attributed to an interruption, hence the savagery of Eddowes' attack by an assumed frustrated Ripper. This is purely speculative. If mutilation was the key, why would the killer attack his victim next to a busy social club? Furthermore, the eyewitness description given by Schwartz of Stride's assailant doesn't jive with the previous murders. And if this man wasn't Stride's killer, it only leaves a small window of opportunity for another murderer to enter stage left.

All we have are two women that are murdered within an hour of each other. Both of them have their throats cut but aside than that there is no evidence that the two murders are related. The only evidence that links them is a letter written by someone claiming to be the killer, which is mainly considered a hoax by most authorities on the subject.
The only problem with not including Stride is that they were not as some would have you believe loads of knife wielding maniacs all running round killing women out on the streets in a small area of London all of a sudden.
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  #56  
Old 04-18-2017, 10:31 AM
Tom_Wescott Tom_Wescott is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vincenzo View Post
I always thought it was possible that Stride refused an offer from her killer togo to a more discreet location and the murderer lost his cool and attacked her on the spot.

If it was indeed JtR (and I believe it was) then it is very possible that he had no concern for location while in the moment.
That's completely possible.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott
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  #57  
Old 04-18-2017, 10:40 AM
John G John G is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vincenzo View Post
I always thought it was possible that Stride refused an offer from her killer togo to a more discreet location and the murderer lost his cool and attacked her on the spot.

If it was indeed JtR (and I believe it was) then it is very possible that he had no concern for location while in the moment.
The problem is Dutfield's Yard was a much better location to commit a murder than, say, where Nichols and Chapman were killed-the street and someone's back yard-if only because it was cloaked in almost pitch black darkness.
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  #58  
Old 04-18-2017, 10:43 AM
Tom_Wescott Tom_Wescott is offline
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Originally Posted by John G View Post
The problem is Dutfield's Yard was a much better location to commit a murder than, say, where Nichols and Chapman were killed-the street and someone's back yard-if only because it was cloaked in almost pitch black darkness.
It was a good place to commit a murder, albeit noisier and probably more stress-inducing for the Ripper, because of the open windows and singing.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott
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  #59  
Old 04-18-2017, 10:50 AM
John G John G is offline
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Originally Posted by Tom_Wescott View Post
It was a good place to commit a murder, albeit noisier and probably more stress-inducing for the Ripper, because of the open windows and singing.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott
Hi Tom, during the period that Stride must have been killed, wasn't there only a handful of people remaining in the club? Could the singing have attracted Stride? Could her killer have enticed her into the Yard by claiming to be a club member and offering to gain her admittance?
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