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Go Back   Casebook Forums > Social Chat > Shades of Whitechapel

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  #1  
Old 07-06-2017, 06:44 PM
Robert St Devil Robert St Devil is offline
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Default Coram St Revisited

i set up my BNA search criteria:
1 Jan 1870 to 31 December 1900
Article tagged "Crime & Punishment"
Dated (earliest)
search term: wideawake hat

My premise was based on Debs thread on Ada Wilson, wondering thru a connection between the wideawake hat from that case AND the same hat mentioned in the Liz Stride case. My intent was simple: look for reports (assaults, occurrences, &c.) involving any man on any woman wearing that hat. Skimming the 7 pages of results, i hit HOXTON first. The billycock hat man & the wideawake hat man.
Next i came to Coram 1872, which i speculatively feel is related "somehow" with Whitechapel 1888. The points of familiarity mentioned within "the story" being:

THE HATS. The billycock, wideawake and peaked hats.
THE CLOTHES. A gentleman of shabby appearance or a mechanic/bricklayer [shades of a Scotland Yard construction site, shades of lime preserving a body]
THE SHOES.
THE BUILD. is he tall or is he approx 5'6" and stout?
BLOTCHY SKIN. Spots described as being the size of sixpence on the wideawake hat man's face.
thomas CORAM. okay, that's a stretch!
THE SOVEREIGN COIN.
THE FRUITMAN &THE GRAPES.
ENGLISH spoken with a detectable germanic accent
An arrested frenchman who reads a poster in english and responds with HA!HA!
BLOOD SPECKLED HANDKERCHIEFS. Were those his handkerchiefs?
Harriet calls Tryphina Douglass the barmaid on the Christmas Eve night of her murder: "FAIRY"

Should Coram St be revisited?
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Last edited by Robert St Devil : 07-06-2017 at 07:10 PM.
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Old 07-07-2017, 03:16 PM
Mayerling Mayerling is offline
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Should the Coram Street Mystery be revisited? Yes, for the sake that one
might find out who the killer was. I like the attempt at comparisons with details with Whitechapel. Main problem: time gap between 1872 and 1888. What is that signifying? Two different killers or one who (we have to assume) was up to other things elsewhere for sixteen years.

Jeff
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Old 07-07-2017, 07:17 PM
Robert St Devil Robert St Devil is offline
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you put the case down, you pick it up again, put it down, pick it up,...
each time, something different. this go is loonier bc im willing to consider anything between 1870 and 1910.

however...

it,s the idea of viewing Autumn of Terror 88 thru the lens of the Coram Street murder mystery in hopes of discovering better questions or probable resolutions.

16 YEARS. the description of the possible killer in 1872 was early 20s. in 1888 he would be late 30s.
RAMSGATE is a port town. Id guess Greater Yarmouth is a port town too. Are all these places he,s claiming to ,,visit,, in his suspected letters port towns also?
A BOAT. well lets just say im wondering about the torso killer here so i wont dwell...
FAIRY. ive been following the tupac and biggie smalls murder mystery on youtube, got called a troll bc i see his chain come out fromunda orlando anderson in the casino fight video, doorknobs in mjk3 all over again. eitherway... tupacs mom,s name is AFENI but he said everyone just called her FAYE. I wonder what nickname they call trYPHENA douglass, the barmaid at the Al Hambra.
WELLINGTON BOOTS. dr hessell is described (i blv) as wearing his trousers over his wellington boots. those boots look like soft hunting boots. the type (i gss) that wouldn,t make much of a sound.
DOUBLE PEAKED HAT. in the Coram St case the wideawake hat is described as an Alpine hat. An Alpine hat is a double peaked hat that ppl mostly associate with Germany... which further influenced the indication of a germanic accent.
VELVET COLLAR. A large overcoat gets mentioned, one with a velvet collar [shades of astrakhan].
PETTY THIEVERY. not the end goal obviously but still evidenced.
LOCKED APARTMENT DOORS. Obviously her killer locked poor Mary Jane... imean, Harriett,s door.
THE HANDKERCHIEFS. if those bloody handkerchiefs were involved in harrietts murder and there,s evidence he wiped the blade on the towel, then what was the purpose of the handkerchief?

i cant rightly claim any hint of what could have happened in those 16 years jeff. i did catch glimpse of a mystery prior to 1888 about an infant whose throat was slashed and body mutilated that caught my attention but i,m reading what i can on Coram St (and Hoxton) for now.
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Old 07-08-2017, 01:43 PM
jerryd jerryd is offline
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Robert and Jeff,

In the early months of 1873, a 23 year old French artist by the name of George Mauduit died of heart failure at 14 Church Street, Soho. It was originally thought he died from poison, but nothing could be found to prove that to be the case.

This location was operated by Sara Hack and her daughter Harriet Wright. After the murder of Buswell in December of 1872, Harriet Wright (landlady of 12 Great Coram Street) moved in with her mother at 14 Church Street. Mauduit's death caught the attention of Inspector Harnett and he noticed the description of Mauduit matched that of the murderer of Buswell. Neither Mrs. Hack nor her daughter could account for Mauduit's movements on the night of Buswell's murder. No more became of it.

Coincidentally, several years later another notorious Londoner was to be a tenant of Sara Hack and Harriet Wright at 14 Church Street. His name was Charles Hammond, the future proprietor of No. 19 Cleveland Street and the main character in a scandal that rocked the core of Britain.

This information was gathered from,The Sins of Jack Saul by Glenn Chandler. I believe Jan Bondeson also wrote something on Mauduit in a Ripperologist article. Just can't find it right now.
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Old 07-08-2017, 02:06 PM
Robert St Devil Robert St Devil is offline
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thnks jerry and how unusual too because i just read jan,s work on coram street in Ripperologist #148 Februaty 2016 (a blk and grn cover with Debra Arif,s research on Elizabeth Prater being the headline).

would you forward me what you find. i think the landlady you mentioned is also mentioned by jan... in connection with a frenchman whose heart stops in the house she moved into; after all of her tenants fled her coram street lodgings, bc the room was haunted by harriet,s ghost. his heart stops, and there is an argument at the inquest between the grocer and his boy-assistants. the grocer swears its dr hessell but the boys get into a ruse about saying it was the frenchman.
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Old 07-08-2017, 03:00 PM
jerryd jerryd is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert St Devil View Post
thnks jerry and how unusual too because i just read jan,s work on coram street in Ripperologist #148 Februaty 2016 (a blk and grn cover with Debra Arif,s research on Elizabeth Prater being the headline).

would you forward me what you find. i think the landlady you mentioned is also mentioned by jan... in connection with a frenchman whose heart stops in the house she moved into; after all of her tenants fled her coram street lodgings, bc the room was haunted by harriet,s ghost. his heart stops, and there is an argument at the inquest between the grocer and his boy-assistants. the grocer swears its dr hessell but the boys get into a ruse about saying it was the frenchman.
Robert,

That is the article I was thinking of. The story of Mauduit appears at the top of page 62 in Ripp 148. Dr. Bondeson spells the name Ma(n)duit but I found the death register in first quarter of 1873 with the spelling Ma(u)duit and he was born in 1850. Glenn Chandler took the research a step further and connected Harriet Wright with Sara Hack and the lodging house at 14 Church Street. Same story, though.

Last edited by jerryd : 07-08-2017 at 03:03 PM.
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Old 07-09-2017, 11:49 AM
Mayerling Mayerling is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert St Devil View Post
RAMSGATE is a port town. Id guess Greater Yarmouth is a port town too. .
If you read Charles Dickens' novel, "David Copperfield", the Pegotty family (who are important in the story's plotting) are a sailing family who live in Yarmouth. It is a port, but a relatively small one.

Jeff
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