The Christie Case

[Pcdunn]

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Roth seems quite the "grey man" as one of the espionage novelists put it-- the ordinary man you'd never suspect of anything in this photo.
The cloud above his head is funny-- looks like a light bulb!
Perhaps he's plotting it all out?

[Sherlock]

It seems that an autobiography by Len Trevallion was published in 2008 entitled "Policeman, Pilot and Guardian Angel" which includes an account of his involvement with Christie when an officer in the Metropolitan Police.

From what I have seen from the preview available on Amazon UK he stated in it that Christie had performed abortions assisted by Ethel, as he had done on the programme presented by Fred Dinenage.

There seems to be no evidence that either Christie or his wife were involved with abortions. What do others think? Was Trevallion lying? I think he said on the tv programme that Christie himself had told him about the abortions.

[Sherlock]

Interestingly, F Tennyson Jesse stated in her introduction to her book on the trials of Evans and Christie that Christie was rumoured in the neighbourhood to be an abortionist and that some people thought that Ethel helped him. However, she was inclined to doubt this. Possibly the rumours came about through Christie telling women in local cafes that he knew how to perform abortions when he in fact had no idea how to do so. Moreover, Ethel does not seem to have been the kind of person who would have been willing to assist her husband in this way.

When Christie's flat was searched in 1949 after Evans had accused him of performing a botched abortion on Beryl nothing was found in it which could have been used in such an operation.

[Sherlock]

If Christie had indeed performed an abortion on any woman, which is far from certain, it would be highly unlikely that they would have come forward after the trial due to the stigma involved and the fact that such operations were illegal, although there must have been quite a few "back street abortionists" in the early 1950s.

It is difficult to know what to make of Trevallion's claim. Perhaps Christie lied to him that he and his wife had carried out abortions for reasons known only to himself. On the other hand, if Christie was indeed involved with them, which is only a slight possibility, then there may have been some truth in Evans's statement that Christie had offered to perform an abortion on Beryl.

Probably the whole truth will never be known.

[Sherlock]

Here are several mysteries arising from the Christie case which have not been resolved and probably never will be:-

1) Did Christie ever carry out an abortion or attempt to do do, as he seems to have claimed to various people to be able to do do?

2) Was he involved with the production or distribution of pornography? He claimed to have taken indecent photographs of a girl named Maureen Briggs in the presence of Kathleen Maloney, one of his final three victims. According to Ludovic Kennedy this took place in a room near Marylebone Lane. Honest John also refers to these activities in his book.

3) As John Eddowes suggests in his book, was he a police informer and did this enable him to be appointed as a Special Constable in 1939 in spite of his criminal record?

4) Why did he commit his first known murder of Ruth Fuerst in 1943 when his previous convictions had mainly been for relatively minor and non-violent crimes, apart from his assault on Maud Cole in 1929? As Honest John has suggested, did he murder Fuerst out of necessity and then resolved to kill again as he had enjoyed the experience?

5) If he did not murder Beryl and Geraldine Evans himself, what did he actually know about these killings?

6) What, if anything, did Ethel know about his activities? Did she ever suspect that he might be a murderer?

7) Did he ever commit any other murders outside 10 Rillington Place?

[Rosella]

Christie must have had self esteem issues! He was a man who seemed to be constantly boosting his reputation up to others." Oh yes, I was a doctor you know, before..." and then some misfortune would be invented which had prevented him from becoming a renowned specialist!

I am sure he did hint to pregnant women that he could solve their little problems for them. He seems to have wanted to be regarded as Mr Omnipotent. However, an out of date first aid book quite obviously does not give the medical know how to perform any medical procedure. Too messy and I just don't think he'd risk it.

After all, his main focus was to get potential victims alone so he could kill and have sex, something he managed by spruiking his method of banishing bronchial problems. With abortions there are sometimes boyfriends and husbands involved, not all as weak minded as Tim Evans.

I especially don't believe that Ethel would be involved in procuring abortions. She was childless herself and I think she would have found such a suggestion very upsetting. Of course, I didn't know her, but from everything that I have read she appears to have been honest to the point of naïveté. Certainly the police regarded her as an honest woman at the time of the police search of 10 Rillington Place. I think Ethel maybe suspected Reg was often up to no good, but publicly she defended him and she did stay with him till the end after that early separation.

I think it's entirely possible that Christie killed elsewhere, especially during times when Ethel was away. He may even have done so much earlier than anyone has ever suggested.

[Rosella]

I also think that Christie could well have been involved in the publication and distribution of pornography as a sideline. It was one of his kinks and certainly something he found enjoyable.

As the self righteous little prig that he was police informing may also have been a hobby, nay a public duty, for him. Whether he pulled favours to become a special police Constable is debatable though. In the chaos of wartime in a pre database age, Christie's previous criminal convictions, especially so far back in time, may well have just allowed him to slip through the net. After all, Donald Merrett alias Ronald Chesney, the Scottish matricide, ended up in the Royal Naval Reserve in World War Two, and the authorities never checked up on him!

[caz]

I think Ethel maybe suspected Reg was often up to no good, but publicly she defended him and she did stay with him till the end after that early separation.

Hi Rosella,

Until he murdered her, you mean? I think he was afraid Ethel suspected him and he had to keep her quiet.

His motive for the others was sexual, but once he had killed several times I don't suppose killing his wife was as difficult for him as it might otherwise have been. He was one evil and devious bastard.

I don't believe for one second that Evans killed his own wife or baby.

Love,

Caz
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[Rosella]

Yes, until Reg murdered her, which was the end for her. I think Christie had his compulsion to kill becoming more and more urgent in the last weeks of his wife's life and Ethel was a nuisance and in the way.

I disagree about Tim Evans. He was a dishonest and quite violent character and would be capable of murder.

[miss marple]

I have just watched the Dineage doc on TV. I thought it was quite good as a summery of the case. Where does the description of 'inaccurate' come in. I suppose if you believe Evans killed either Beryl or Geraldine you would think it was inaccurate.
Murdering Ruth Fuerst because Christie thought she would welch to Ethel seems logical and then discovering he good a kick out of murder.
Christie did not have to be an abortionist, he just had to convince women he was. It was a good excuse to get them in the chair.I don't think Ethel helped him, but she was under his thumb. They did present a united front at the Evans trial.
I don't think Evans was a killer, never have. He was a man of weak intellect easily manipulated by a devious psycopath who he trusted.
The most interesting aspect of the Dineage doc was the evidence of the forensic writing expert and the sophisticated language used in the confession statement by Evans,which was not his normal speech. It was easy for the police to manipulate his confession. There have been many inaccurate 'confession' statements over the years by weak minded individuals.
Psycopaths like control and power and withhold information to retain that power. Ian Brady is an example. Christie retained control by denying the murder of Geraldine and then causing more pain to Evan's Mother by denying he murdered Beryl. So he kept control to the last.

I loved the Attenborough film, in spite of its faults, very well made and creepy.

Miss Marple

'

[contrafib]

Oh dear, seems like that Tim Roth version is simply taking the 'standard version'. So, other than just a decent piece of drama, it seems utterly pointless.

Does nobody know anyone with filmmaking capabilities who could put together something with 2 possible scenarios, both given equal validity? I'd promote it to the hilt if they could

Maybe a narrated version of John Curnow's excellent e-book??

[caz]

I'm not sure I could stomach any drama suggesting there were two active murderers living in that house at the same time. For me it would be almost as bad as a drama suggesting Crippen's wife survived and the remains found were male.

Love,

Caz
X

[Rosella]

I certainly don't believe that the body found at Crippen's house was anyone other than Mrs Crippen, otherwise known as Belle Elmore. On the other hand, as regards the events at 10 Rillington Place, I do believe it is possible that two killers lived there, one a serial killer driven by his own compulsions, the other a rather bad tempered young man who had a troubled marriage and killed his wife in a rage, a common or garden domestic homicide. Evans knew nothing of Christie's proclivities, I believe, but I certainly think Christie knew what Evans had been up to.

[Semper_Eadem]

I think the murder of Beryl and Geraldine should be laid on Christie as he had killed women before. As far as I know Evans had never murdered anyone. yet Christie had, making it very likely that he murdered Beryl and then Geraldine. What is Christie going to do with a one year old. He could of left her somewhere but instead he strangled her and probably buried her in the garden.

Christie himself confessed to Beryl's murder. He know that the public outcry would be if he confessed to murdering a defenseless toddler so he kept quiet about murdering little Geraldine but an inquiry in 1966 judged him guilty of that as well, probably with compelling reasons.

---
As for the flap of skin of Cora Crippen's being found to be male, well she was wearing men's pajamas when she was murdered and her body was wrapped in them. Perhaps DNA from the jammies contaminated her remains with DNA from someone who had worn them before she had?

[caz]

Good post, Semper.

Love,

Caz
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