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Go Back   Casebook Forums > Ripper Discussions > Police Officials and Procedures > General Police Discussion

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  #11  
Old 01-08-2017, 08:12 AM
The Station Cat The Station Cat is offline
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Needle in a hay stack, springs to mind, but lets examine the evidence.....

We know he was in the police in, certainly in 1887 and we know that he was still serving in 1888 and that the City Police at that time consisted of 1 Chief Superintendent, 1 Superintendent, 14 Inspectors, 92 Sergeants, and 781 Constables. Spread over 3 stations, one of which was at Bishopsgate. Which is only 4 minutes walk from where this picture was taken.

We know that he had previous military service. The Afghanistan campaign was between 1878 & 1880.

We know that this photograph was taken at sometime between 1902 & 1909.
He appears to have some sort of connection other than the police, with the City of London, given the other "medals" he is wearing. Which would suggest City Police as apposed to Metropolitan Police.

I would hazard that he's in his late forties in this picture and that he was perhaps retired by this point?
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  #12  
Old 01-09-2017, 03:40 AM
The Station Cat The Station Cat is offline
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I've asked the opinion of an expert*Masonic jewels and he doesn't believe that they are Masonic,*but are most likely connected to the City of London, perhaps from a Livery Company or someone connected with The Lord Mayor’s Show.*
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  #13  
Old 01-09-2017, 05:46 AM
Robert Robert is offline
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Here's a link to some info :

http://www.britnumsoc.org/publicatio...1_BNJ_21_9.pdf

But I still say the second one down on his lapel is Blue Peter.
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  #14  
Old 01-09-2017, 05:54 AM
The Station Cat The Station Cat is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert View Post
Here's a link to some info :

http://www.britnumsoc.org/publicatio...1_BNJ_21_9.pdf

But I still say the second one down on his lapel is Blue Peter.

Many thanks for the link, Robert. His medal doesn't look like any of the ones pictured, so perhaps its not a Livery medal, Lord Mayors show perhaps?
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  #15  
Old 01-09-2017, 06:32 AM
Robert Robert is offline
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It doesn't seem to be the City of London shield. If only I could read the lettering.
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  #16  
Old 01-09-2017, 06:46 AM
The Station Cat The Station Cat is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert View Post
It doesn't seem to be the City of London shield. If only I could read the lettering.

That's interesting I felt sure it was City of London? But I was basing this on the fact that the picture was taken in Bishopsgate.


Unfortunately I'm unable to make it any bigger, I'll get a magnifying glass out and see if I can read anything.
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  #17  
Old 01-09-2017, 07:04 AM
Joshua Rogan Joshua Rogan is offline
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It looks fairly similar to the City of London Coat of Arms to me, although it's far from clear. There is a faint blob in the top left quadrant of the shield which I take (imagine) to be a sword. I'm sure small differences make a big difference in heraldry, but one big difference seems to be that instead of the shield being surmounted by a helmet, it is surmounted by a crown....Which could be significant.
Here is a page on what the crown means in heraldic terms;

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crown_(heraldry)

Wasn't a jubilee medal awarded to people other than just policemen? A quick Google says the following;

"The medal was awarded to members of the Royal Family and the court, guests at the celebrations of Queen Victoria's golden jubilee and the soldiers and sailors that paraded that day in London.

The medals were made in two categories - (1) Queen Victoria's Golden Jubilee Medal (Gold, Silver and Copper) and (2) Queen Victoria's Golden Jubilee Police Medal (Copper)."

The medal was made in gold and silver and copper with gold and silver medals going to individuals of higher rank."

Appropriate that the police medal was copper.

I did think the Afghan campaign medal might provide a clue. So I went through a medal roll that I had handy (9th Lancers) ad found that there were about 30 men (out of about 600) who were awarded the medal and one clasp, but no Kabul to Kandahar Star. But of course there were dozens of other regiments in Afghanistan, and most weren't even eligible for the star, so it doesn't really mean much. Needle in a haystack, as said.
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  #18  
Old 01-09-2017, 07:22 AM
The Station Cat The Station Cat is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joshua Rogan View Post
It looks fairly similar to the City of London Coat of Arms to me, although it's far from clear. There is a faint blob in the top left quadrant of the shield which I take (imagine) to be a sword. I'm sure small differences make a big difference in heraldry, but one big difference seems to be that instead of the shield being surmounted by a helmet, it is surmounted by a crown....Which could be significant.
Here is a page on what the crown means in heraldic terms;

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crown_(heraldry)

Wasn't a jubilee medal awarded to people other than just policemen? A quick Google says the following;

"The medal was awarded to members of the Royal Family and the court, guests at the celebrations of Queen Victoria's golden jubilee and the soldiers and sailors that paraded that day in London.

The medals were made in two categories - (1) Queen Victoria's Golden Jubilee Medal (Gold, Silver and Copper) and (2) Queen Victoria's Golden Jubilee Police Medal (Copper)."

The medal was made in gold and silver and copper with gold and silver medals going to individuals of higher rank."

Appropriate that the police medal was copper.

I did think the Afghan campaign medal might provide a clue. So I went through a medal roll that I had handy (9th Lancers) ad found that there were about 30 men (out of about 600) who were awarded the medal and one clasp, but no Kabul to Kandahar Star. But of course there were dozens of other regiments in Afghanistan, and most weren't even eligible for the star, so it doesn't really mean much. Needle in a haystack, as said.




Thanks for your reply Joshua.

I fear I'll never be able to put a name to this chaps face. Which is such a shame as I'm sure he would have had an interesting tale to tell.
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