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Go Back   Casebook Forums > Social Chat > Shades of Whitechapel

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  #21  
Old 12-08-2017, 01:36 PM
RockySullivan RockySullivan is offline
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Originally Posted by Abby Normal View Post
I just checked out the link to the AC murders. I don't really see why they are connected to the LISK and apparently investigators don't either.

why do you think they may be connected?
Abby like I said upthread, the lead AC Homicide detective personally stated on TV news interview that he knew for a fact the cases are related. Not sure what to make of it, but there are plenty of connections to the LISK case. And Kim Raffo growing up so close to John Bittrolff is one of the most significant
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  #22  
Old 12-08-2017, 01:45 PM
RockySullivan RockySullivan is offline
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Like I said if Bittrolff is the LISK than he's the AC killer as well because he sought out and killed the friend of the daughter of Rita Tangredi his first victim and he sought out and killed Kim Raffo a girl he must have known in elementary. Its a far fetched theory but nothing else really makes sense, unless they are coincidences, in which case then I would say Bittrolff is not LISK. If Bittrolff isn't LISK, then I'm not sure AC is the same killer. Its confusing I know.
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  #23  
Old 12-08-2017, 02:27 PM
Abby Normal Abby Normal is offline
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Like I said if Bittrolff is the LISK than he's the AC killer as well because he sought out and killed the friend of the daughter of Rita Tangredi his first victim and he sought out and killed Kim Raffo a girl he must have known in elementary. Its a far fetched theory but nothing else really makes sense, unless they are coincidences, in which case then I would say Bittrolff is not LISK. If Bittrolff isn't LISK, then I'm not sure AC is the same killer. Its confusing I know.
no I'm with you.
Do we know where Bittrolff was at the end of 2006? was he in AC?
All four of those victims were killed and dumped within days of each other in oct/nov of 2006.

They were all Ided.

do we know if they were dismembered?
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quite tallies with the descriptions I got of him."

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  #24  
Old 12-08-2017, 03:39 PM
RockySullivan RockySullivan is offline
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no I'm with you.
Do we know where Bittrolff was at the end of 2006? was he in AC?
All four of those victims were killed and dumped within days of each other in oct/nov of 2006.

They were all Ided.

do we know if they were dismembered?
Well within days, but over the course of a month from sometime in october until Nov 20. I have heard from a colleague that according to relatives he was home in October and November on LI. Now that doesn't mean he couldnt drive out to AC one night each weekend but i think it's unlikely. They weren't dismembered Abby, strangled with shoes missing. Go back and read this article from 2011: https://nypost.com/2011/04/08/cops-e...sland-murders/

Interesting how their suspect had a connection Kim Raffo and her stay on LI. But this was 2 years before Bittrolff's brother was arrested and they got a familial match which is when cops says he came to their attention.
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  #25  
Old 12-08-2017, 03:58 PM
Abby Normal Abby Normal is offline
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Well within days, but over the course of a month from sometime in october until Nov 20. I have heard from a colleague that according to relatives he was home in October and November on LI. Now that doesn't mean he couldnt drive out to AC one night each weekend but i think it's unlikely. They weren't dismembered Abby, strangled with shoes missing. Go back and read this article from 2011: https://nypost.com/2011/04/08/cops-e...sland-murders/

Interesting how their suspect had a connection Kim Raffo and her stay on LI. But this was 2 years before Bittrolff's brother was arrested and they got a familial match which is when cops says he came to their attention.
Well since this is in 2011 they might have got the wrong suspect. If she was staying in LI shortly before she took off for NJ and as you say knew him from school, then..... he may have followed her down and spent a few weeks killing prostitutes.

I take anything family says about alibis with a grain of salt though.

Her knowing him from school and LI connection might just be a coincidence.
Iím still leaning to ac and LI murders beingdifferent killers, but Iím still a relative noob. If I learn of any significant similarities ....that might change it though.
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"Is all that we see or seem
but a dream within a dream?"

-Edgar Allan Poe


"...the man and the peaked cap he is said to have worn
quite tallies with the descriptions I got of him."

-Frederick G. Abberline
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  #26  
Old 12-08-2017, 04:48 PM
RockySullivan RockySullivan is offline
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Well since this is in 2011 they might have got the wrong suspect. If she was staying in LI shortly before she took off for NJ and as you say knew him from school, then..... he may have followed her down and spent a few weeks killing prostitutes.

I take anything family says about alibis with a grain of salt though.

Her knowing him from school and LI connection might just be a coincidence.
I’m still leaning to ac and LI murders beingdifferent killers, but I’m still a relative noob. If I learn of any significant similarities ....that might change it though.
There isn;t much that links the cases to be honest, except that both were 4 sex workers. AC 06 then Gilgo 4 start in 2007 and span 3 years. Kim Raffo's connection to Mastic and her stay on LI before her death. They are very different. Could be a clammer in both cases, and there were some POI's in Kim Raffo's murder who were from Queens and who police were looking and they were asking about a Clam Bar in Queens. So I keep the door open. As for the suspect, as you well know police might have been wrong, or right with no proof, or they might have cleared him incorrectly.

Edit: And Abby dont forget what the detective said. He must have the scoop on the Queens guys/clamming angle so if he says it's connected he may know what he;s talking about. Dont forget now the Chief, and the DA for SCPD who figure very priminintely in LISK case were both arrested.

Last edited by RockySullivan : 12-08-2017 at 04:55 PM.
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  #27  
Old 12-09-2017, 04:55 AM
Abby Normal Abby Normal is offline
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Originally Posted by RockySullivan View Post
There isn;t much that links the cases to be honest, except that both were 4 sex workers. AC 06 then Gilgo 4 start in 2007 and span 3 years. Kim Raffo's connection to Mastic and her stay on LI before her death. They are very different. Could be a clammer in both cases, and there were some POI's in Kim Raffo's murder who were from Queens and who police were looking and they were asking about a Clam Bar in Queens. So I keep the door open. As for the suspect, as you well know police might have been wrong, or right with no proof, or they might have cleared him incorrectly.

Edit: And Abby dont forget what the detective said. He must have the scoop on the Queens guys/clamming angle so if he says it's connected he may know what he;s talking about. Dont forget now the Chief, and the DA for SCPD who figure very priminintely in LISK case were both arrested.
Hi rocky
The ac cases have been since 2006, over ten years for them to work on the case and itís still not linked to LISK so I have my doubts.

In my mind itís rather simple. Bitrolf is the LISK, and the ac cases may or may not be him. I think weíll find out soon.
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"Is all that we see or seem
but a dream within a dream?"

-Edgar Allan Poe


"...the man and the peaked cap he is said to have worn
quite tallies with the descriptions I got of him."

-Frederick G. Abberline
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  #28  
Old 12-09-2017, 05:03 AM
RockySullivan RockySullivan is offline
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Well Abby I dont think either department has gotten anywhere in ten years but if they have they both are tight lipped about it. Police don't release info at all in these two cases but again the detective did state the cases are related.
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  #29  
Old 12-09-2017, 05:10 AM
RockySullivan RockySullivan is offline
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I mean Abby don't forget if JB is LISK he killed 2 girls in November then one in Jan and he beat them up and posed them in the woods. All 3 were identified. Then a 2 year gap and Fire Island Jane Doe who is dismembered, legs dumped somewhere near fire island, head on gilgo beach and torso who knows where.
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  #30  
Old 12-09-2017, 05:55 AM
Abby Normal Abby Normal is offline
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I mean Abby don't forget if JB is LISK he killed 2 girls in November then one in Jan and he beat them up and posed them in the woods. All 3 were identified. Then a 2 year gap and Fire Island Jane Doe who is dismembered, legs dumped somewhere near fire island, head on gilgo beach and torso who knows where.
Hey rocky
Where JBs victims dismembered? I don’t think they were. Just want to confirm.
__________________
"Is all that we see or seem
but a dream within a dream?"

-Edgar Allan Poe


"...the man and the peaked cap he is said to have worn
quite tallies with the descriptions I got of him."

-Frederick G. Abberline

Last edited by Abby Normal : 12-09-2017 at 06:17 AM.
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