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  #11  
Old 12-17-2015, 12:04 PM
ColdCaseJury ColdCaseJury is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hatchett View Post
Hi,

Whether or not Camb actually killed her is open to consideration. What I think is not open to consideration is that he was a sexual predator... Just a point on the legal issue. A prosecutor must prove ... to the jury's satisfaction ..... beyond a reasonable doubt.
Thanks for your comment. In my book I publish for the first time the actual affidavits of women who allege they were molested by Camb. It makes interesting (but perhaps disturbing) reading.

Many commentators believe that, despite the original jury's verdict, there was a reasonable doubt whether Camb murdered Gay Gibson. For the Cold Case Jury, however, I always ask the reader to decide what most likely happened after presenting all the evidence. At the moment the verdict of the Cold Case Jury is that James Camb most likely murdered Gay Gibson.
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  #12  
Old 12-28-2015, 01:54 PM
ColdCaseJury ColdCaseJury is offline
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Default Current Verdict

The current verdict of the Cold Case Jury is that 70% believe it was a case of murder.

This may change as more verdicts are polled

Antony Matthew Brown
Author of Death of an Actress
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  #13  
Old 12-29-2015, 01:51 PM
GUT GUT is offline
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Unfortunately I don't place much weight on these type of Polls.

I get asked all the time, "What o you think bout X case" "was it the right verdict" "Wasn't the sentence light/heavy?" etc

My answer is invariably "Without seeing ALL the evidence it's impossible to say".
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  #14  
Old 12-29-2015, 02:38 PM
OneRound OneRound is offline
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Originally Posted by GUT View Post
Unfortunately I don't place much weight on these type of Polls.

I get asked all the time, "What o you think bout X case" "was it the right verdict" "Wasn't the sentence light/heavy?" etc

My answer is invariably "Without seeing ALL the evidence it's impossible to say".
Hi GUT - that's fair enough although I suspect you've just walked into an advert for ColdCase's book!

Best regards,
OneRound
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  #15  
Old 12-29-2015, 04:09 PM
GUT GUT is offline
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Hi GUT - that's fair enough although I suspect you've just walked into an advert for ColdCase's book!

Best regards,
OneRound
Seems like it.
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  #16  
Old 12-29-2015, 04:34 PM
Graham Graham is offline
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I think I have to go along with GUT regarding polls....too much possibility of something like "oooh, I didn't like his face", or "she looked a bit too sneaky for me"; things along those lines.

As far as Camb is concerned, he did try the good old tactic of corpus delecti, as attempted by Haig the Acid-Bath Murderer some years later, and who, like Camb, found it a somewhat rocky defence. Frankly, if the woman was known to be in Camb's cabin, did not emerge and was not seen again during the rest of the voyage, did folk expect her to have thrown herself out of the port-hole? Camb was incredibly lucky to get away with this, and there is no doubt in my mind that he did her in. As to the rather macabre suggestion that she she 'still alive' as she was shoved through the port-hole, well, who apart from Camb would know? And would he say? Not very likely......

Graham
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  #17  
Old 12-29-2015, 05:00 PM
Rosella Rosella is offline
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Gaye wasn't in Camb's cabin though, Graham. He was in hers, in a quite different part of the ship, and the question of how he inveigled his way into her cabin (or was invited) formed a substantial part of the trial.

As for the polls, well they are just a bit of fun, aren't they? A man's life doesn't depend upon the verdict and I'm sure (at least hope) that if we were on a real life jury at a murder trial we'd all try our best to come to the right decision.

I enjoyed this book. I'd only read about the Porthole murder briefly before and this had a great deal of information I found interesting.
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  #18  
Old 12-30-2015, 12:10 AM
Mayerling Mayerling is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Graham View Post
I think I have to go along with GUT regarding polls....too much possibility of something like "oooh, I didn't like his face", or "she looked a bit too sneaky for me"; things along those lines.

As far as Camb is concerned, he did try the good old tactic of corpus delecti, as attempted by Haig the Acid-Bath Murderer some years later, and who, like Camb, found it a somewhat rocky defence. Frankly, if the woman was known to be in Camb's cabin, did not emerge and was not seen again during the rest of the voyage, did folk expect her to have thrown herself out of the port-hole? Camb was incredibly lucky to get away with this, and there is no doubt in my mind that he did her in. As to the rather macabre suggestion that she she 'still alive' as she was shoved through the port-hole, well, who apart from Camb would know? And would he say? Not very likely......

Graham
Hi Graham,

From what I've read about Haigh, his idea seemed (to him, anyway) fool-proof because he misunderstood the term "corpus delicti" to mean having the actual corpse available to look at. He did not realize it could be traces of the corpse (as it turned out there still were, including false teeth of the victim). He was also far too cool and flippant regarding the grim situation, when pieces of Mrs. Durand-Deacon's jewelry and her fur coat showed up that were traceable to his possession (and people knew he was going to see her that last day anyone else saw her). His behavior reminds one of other overly confident "perfect murder killers" like Rouse, who willingly talked about his huge number of sexual conquests as his harem. Haigh apparently turned his modus operandi into a joke, when his paddy wagon to court got into a traffic jam, by suggesting he had a way to make the offending horse causing it to disappear!!

Haigh also tried to make his killing (later revealed to be the latest of a series going back to the early 1940s) into proof of being mentally unbalanced. He told of dreams with cross like trees leaking blood, and of drinking blood and urine from his victims. One book I actually have read suggested that Haigh might be considered the last "vampire" hanged in England. As the Attorney General, Sir Hartley Shawcross, said in his summation Haigh was bad not mad. Every killing he made that was proved to have been done increased his immediate bank account.

Jeff
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  #19  
Old 12-30-2015, 07:54 AM
Graham Graham is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rosella View Post
Gaye wasn't in Camb's cabin though, Graham. He was in hers, in a quite different part of the ship, and the question of how he inveigled his way into her cabin (or was invited) formed a substantial part of the trial.

As for the polls, well they are just a bit of fun, aren't they? A man's life doesn't depend upon the verdict and I'm sure (at least hope) that if we were on a real life jury at a murder trial we'd all try our best to come to the right decision.

I enjoyed this book. I'd only read about the Porthole murder briefly before and this had a great deal of information I found interesting.
Hi Rosella,

yeah, you're right about the polls - I've got the post-Christmas miseries, that's all. Take no notice.

The Camb Case is one I've read very little about, so forgive my mistake re: the cabin. He seemed a proper nasty piece of work.

Graham
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  #20  
Old 12-30-2015, 08:11 AM
Graham Graham is offline
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Hi Jeff,

yes indeed, old Haigh dropped a real blooper there - Mrs Durand-Deacon's false gnashers were in those days probably made of porcelain anyway, which I don't think would have been completely dissolved by anything. He should have popped them out, to be on the safe side. Apparently it's very difficult to remove all traces of a body by the use of corrosive chemicals. Still, Haigh had a good go!

BTW, I have a feeling that his premises at No 2 Leopold Road in Crawley are still standing.

Graham
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