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Go Back   Casebook Forums > Ripper Discussions > Suspects > Kosminski, Aaron

View Poll Results: Is Kosminski the best Ripper suspect?
Yes 25 28.41%
No 47 53.41%
Maybe? 16 18.18%
Voters: 88. You may not vote on this poll

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  #681  
Old 02-21-2017, 03:27 PM
Phil Carter Phil Carter is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sam Flynn View Post
When Kłosowski was arrested almost precisely 14 years after the Ripper murders, Abberline is said to have praised George Godley for having caught "Jack the Ripper at last", and went on to say as much in subsequent newspaper interviews. Like Swanson, Abberline was a distinguished detective minutely involved in the case, and - like Swanson - we all greatly admire and respect him. However, that doesn't mean that his indictment of Kłosowski was anything other than a post hoc exercise in supposition, and it certainly doesn't mean that Kłosowski was a Ripper suspect until after his arrest in 1902; indeed, it very much appears that he wasn't. By extension, it is equally possible that Kosminski's "career" as a Ripper suspect might have started and proceeded along very similar lines, and by a similar process of speculation on Swanson's part.
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  #682  
Old Yesterday, 06:46 AM
John Wheat John Wheat is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sam Flynn View Post
When Kłosowski was arrested almost precisely 14 years after the Ripper murders, Abberline is said to have praised George Godley for having caught "Jack the Ripper at last", and went on to say as much in subsequent newspaper interviews. Like Swanson, Abberline was a distinguished detective minutely involved in the case, and - like Swanson - he is widely admired and respected by ripperologists. However, that doesn't mean that his indictment of Kłosowski was anything other than a post hoc exercise in supposition, and it certainly doesn't mean that Kłosowski was a Ripper suspect until sometime after his arrest in 1902 (indeed, it very much appears that he wasn't). By extension, it is equally possible that Kosminski's "career" as a Ripper suspect proceeded along very similar lines, started by a similar process of speculation on Macnaghten's (or even Swanson's) part.
And this is one of the reason's why Kosminski is not the best Ripper suspect or even a good Ripper suspect.
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  #683  
Old Yesterday, 07:25 AM
jason_c jason_c is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sam Flynn View Post
When Kłosowski was arrested almost precisely 14 years after the Ripper murders, Abberline is said to have praised George Godley for having caught "Jack the Ripper at last", and went on to say as much in subsequent newspaper interviews. Like Swanson, Abberline was a distinguished detective minutely involved in the case, and - like Swanson - he is widely admired and respected by ripperologists. However, that doesn't mean that his indictment of Kłosowski was anything other than a post hoc exercise in supposition, and it certainly doesn't mean that Kłosowski was a Ripper suspect until sometime after his arrest in 1902 (indeed, it very much appears that he wasn't). By extension, it is equally possible that Kosminski's "career" as a Ripper suspect proceeded along very similar lines, started by a similar process of speculation on Macnaghten's (or even Swanson's) part.
Most of which is already known, and doesn't take away from Kosminski being the best suspect. The case against Kosminski had some meat on it's bones, it is not purely speculative. We have a witness who states Kosminski was there; that is a contemporary piece of evidence. We know for a fact that a police investigation against someone believed to be called Kosminski took place, we don't know that about Klosowski.

I still find it hard to believe that im having to argue against respected posters who believe that a witness stating Kosminski was at a murder scene does not constitute the best evidence we have against any individual. I fully admit that this information passed down to us is flawed, but it is still the single greatest piece of evidence we have against anyone.

Can I ask what evidence you feel is stronger against any other of the Ripper suspects?
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  #684  
Old Yesterday, 07:59 AM
Abby Normal Abby Normal is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jason_c View Post
Most of which is already known, and doesn't take away from Kosminski being the best suspect. The case against Kosminski had some meat on it's bones, it is not purely speculative. We have a witness who states Kosminski was there; that is a contemporary piece of evidence. We know for a fact that a police investigation against someone believed to be called Kosminski took place, we don't know that about Klosowski.

I still find it hard to believe that im having to argue against respected posters who believe that a witness stating Kosminski was at a murder scene does not constitute the best evidence we have against any individual. I fully admit that this information passed down to us is flawed, but it is still the single greatest piece of evidence we have against anyone.

Can I ask what evidence you feel is stronger against any other of the Ripper suspects?
You are correct. Koz is the only suspect where there is any direct evidence against. The apparently positive ID by a witness.
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  #685  
Old Yesterday, 01:18 PM
Sam Flynn Sam Flynn is offline
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Originally Posted by jason_c View Post
Can I ask what evidence you feel is stronger against any other of the Ripper suspects?
Certainly, Jason: I don't feel that the evidence is strong against any of them. That's not a cop-out, by the way.

I'll expand on that a little. Stronger cases have been made for Bury, Klosowski and even George Hutchinson, in the first two instances because they were known misogynists who murdered women, and in the second for details of Hutchinson's whereabouts, movements and (arguably) suspicious behaviour at the time of Mary Kelly's death. I don't believe that either was Jack the Ripper, but they have stronger claims to infamy than Kosminski, whose "foreign madman" status might have been sufficient reason, perhaps the only reason, to have brought him to the attention of the police.
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  #686  
Old Yesterday, 01:26 PM
Sam Flynn Sam Flynn is offline
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Originally Posted by Abby Normal View Post
You are correct. Koz is the only suspect where there is any direct evidence against. The apparently positive ID by a witness.
That's anecdotal, as opposed to direct evidence, in a book written by a man who appeared to be disdainful of Jews. Not the best source one could hope for in this context.
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  #687  
Old Yesterday, 02:11 PM
John Wheat John Wheat is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Abby Normal View Post
You are correct. Koz is the only suspect where there is any direct evidence against. The apparently positive ID by a witness.
I have to disagree the evidence against Koz is not direct evidence.

Cheers John
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  #688  
Old Yesterday, 09:58 PM
Damaso Marte Damaso Marte is offline
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Originally Posted by John Wheat View Post
I have to disagree the evidence against Koz is not direct evidence.

Cheers John
Can you agree that at the very least its reliability can be called into question, given that it is not an official record?

In my view we have at different tiers of suspect.

Tier 1a
People who were investigated by the police as a suspect, and where we do not have a compelling reason to dismiss them. I believe Kosminski falls into this category. I would not put Druitt into this category but some would. George Chapman may be in this category.

Tier 1b
People who were not investigated by the police as a suspect, but who can be placed at a murder scene. Hello, Hutchinson and Cross.

Tier 2
People who were investigated by the police as a suspect, but where we have a compelling reason to dismiss them. Ostrog, for example.

Tier 3
"They were in London at the time" - most suspects.

Tier 4
"We can't even prove they were in London at the time" - Vincent Van Gogh, James Maybrick, etc.

In this view, Kosminski is indeed one of the stronger suspects, but it's a tallest midget contest.
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