The Paranormal

[gnote]

I said that experimental studies outside of the lab are beset by confounding variables, so that is why a non experimental observational study should be used in natural environment. Paranormal research at the site of paranormal activity is my favoured study. Lab experiments including Zenner cards and such things are less interesting

So in other words moving the goalposts.

[Scorpio]

So in other words moving the goalposts.

What the feck are you on about, gnote?

[kensei]

I was just having some thoughts on hoaxes and the paranormal, and how they are treated by the mainstream media in our sound byte culture.

Doug & Dave admit to faking crop circles. The media then trumpets that all crop circles are now revealed as frauds- even though Doug & Dave admitted that they hadn't done them all and that went without saying anyway.

The Surgeon's Photo from Loch Ness is declared a fake in a deathbed confession. Banner headlines then declare that the entire Loch Ness Monster phenomenon has been exposed as fake.

These are examples of major leaps in logic and interpretation by the media, and unfortunately the suggestible public tends to believe them. Maybe there is nothing to crop circles or Nessie, but debunking single cases does not overturn whole phenomena. I think that tendency should be of special interest to Casebook members right now, as the mainstream media is currently mentioning with casual matter-of-factness here and there how Jack the Ripper has finally been identified by DNA, when many of us strongly suspect that "Shawlgate" is either a mistake or, worse, a fraud. Large segments of the population will now take this as a given while Ripperologists continue to debate the evidence. Though there's nothing paranormal about Jack the Ripper (to most, anyway), I think it's an apt comparison.

[Rosella]

I post on the Lizzie Borden Forum. The Borden house in Fall River, Mass. is now a thriving Bed and Breakfast. For several years visitors staying there are soaking up the paranormal atmosphere, not with the ghost of Lizzie or the Borden victims, but the spirits of children who've been seen and heard around the cellar of the house. These children are supposedly the victims in an earlier murder/suicide which occurred in a nearby house. Nothing to do with Lizzie at all, but it's packing them in.

[Scorpio]

The human obssesion with the supernatural is a decent study its own right.

[Batman]

I was just having some thoughts on hoaxes and the paranormal, and how they are treated by the mainstream media in our sound byte culture.

It's called the history channel and Ancient Aliens or whatever monster/supernatural show they are putting out today.

Doug & Dave admit to faking crop circles. The media then trumpets that all crop circles are now revealed as frauds- even though Doug & Dave admitted that they hadn't done them all and that went without saying anyway.

The media is overwhelming into this magical stuff because it sells, not the the killjoy of science.

The Surgeon's Photo from Loch Ness is declared a fake in a deathbed confession. Banner headlines then declare that the entire Loch Ness Monster phenomenon has been exposed as fake.

The Loch Ness Monster claims have been exposed as a fake a long time ago because the lake is unable to support large creatures because its ecology is that of a dead lake. You simply can't have a big creature living there because it can't live (no food).

The Surgeon's Photo just goes to show how gullable people are.

These are examples of major leaps in logic and interpretation by the media, and unfortunately the suggestible public tends to believe them.

The public trend is certainly not science.

Maybe there is nothing to crop circles or Nessie, but debunking single cases does not overturn whole phenomena.

Debunking single cases leaves us with what eventually if all are debunked? Nothing.

with casual matter-of-factness here and there how Jack the Ripper has finally been identified by DNA, when many of us strongly suspect that "Shawlgate" is either a mistake or, worse, a fraud. Large segments of the population will now take this as a given while Ripperologists continue to debate the evidence. Though there's nothing paranormal about Jack the Ripper (to most, anyway), I think it's an apt comparison.

The only people claiming to solve JtR with DNA are selling books. Like the Maybrick's Diary there have been a drove of JtR historians pointing out the errors of their poorly constructed "scientific" claims.

It's science by the way, not magic belief systems, that overturned the shawl findings.

[Amanda]

Extremes....

I think that the Loch Ness Monster, Yeti, etc should be tentatively put into the 'urban myth' category until proven otherwise.
However, I do feel that paranormal activity, ghosts, spirits, whatever you want to call them are something else altogether.

The Russian scientist Konstantin Korotkov has studied the thesis of the human soul for many years and has actually been able to capture what he believes to be the soul leaving the body, by means of a bioelectrographic camera.
If his research is to be believed, we all possess a certain amount of 'life force', therefore it would be reasonable to conclude that the energy from our souls could have the capability to exist externally after our body is deceased.

Amanda

[Batman]

If his research is to be believed, we all possess a certain amount of 'life force', therefore it would be reasonable to conclude that the energy from our souls could have the capability to exist externally after our body is deceased.

From what I understand the photograph never turned up and a few alledged photographs of said process turned out to be taken with a sauna.

His photography also finds a 'life force' around non-living things.

I think its just a photography artifact caused by the process.

[Robert]

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0069738/

[miss marple]

I am a skeptic and always look for a rational explanation for strange happenings. Yet I have had things happen in houses where i have lived, but i have always ignored them or not considered them weird. Things that were observed by others.
1 As a teenager I lived in the top floor of a very large semi detached Edwardian flat in north London with my Mother. In the sitting room we sometimes heard a crying whiney baby. Oh its coming from next door we said.My best friend who was living with us for a while also heard it. the only problem was the crying baby went on for about 8 years After I went to college out of London. I came back in the holidays to discover my mother sleeping in the front room because a creature was pressing on her chest [ like Fuseli's nightmare ] in the bedroom. She was very disturbed by this and sold the flat. My explanation is she was going through the menapause and having strange symptoms.Crying baby dunno,

2 When I was a student in Norwich I lived in a gothic house by the broads with several other students, some science. The house felt very spooky and several people claimed to have seen stuff [ no they were not doing acid] i had lived in two rooms while I was there One room definately had a presence. It was a ground floor back with french windows leading to the huge garden.I felt i was being watched in that room and sometimes heard breathing and voices. One morning i was alone in the house in the room and heard a mumoured conversation and laughter coming from upstairs. I just thought someone must be in. when someone came back about an hour later in car up drive we went up stairs it was empty. After I moved out and was visiting,the person who had moved into that room mentioned the voices. i was amazed. I was never bothered by this weird stuff it did not feel bad.
3 I had a small terraced house which I sold in 2010. The thing is the person living in it after me had it exorcised. There was an earthy smell in back room,always there in spite of new floorboards, She claimed things moved and she heard footsteps on the stairs. I heard footstops too and rattling of the door knocker in quick stacato knocks. But I always put the noise down to next door but the door knocker thing was odd as there was never anyone there. My son at ten claimed to chat to someone on the stairs gut we poopooed him. When I told him about the exorcism last year, he was very indignant that his ghost had been removed from the house and said he chatted to him for years as a little kid and we never believed him and the spirit meant no harm. I was gobsmacked, He is very rational.
I dont believe in ghosts but some places have very bad vibes mabe due to past experiences. I kmow several people to whom weird things have happened. I think it is quite common.

Miss Marple

[pinkmoon]

I think that the Loch Ness Monster, Yeti, etc should be tentatively put into the 'urban myth' category until proven otherwise.
However, I do feel that paranormal activity, ghosts, spirits, whatever you want to call them are something else altogether.

The Russian scientist Konstantin Korotkov has studied the thesis of the human soul for many years and has actually been able to capture what he believes to be the soul leaving the body, by means of a bioelectrographic camera.
If his research is to be believed, we all possess a certain amount of 'life force', therefore it would be reasonable to conclude that the energy from our souls could have the capability to exist externally after our body is deceased.

Amanda

The loch Ness monster seems to have died a death since the quality of camcorders ,digital cameras and phones has improved there is no excuse for taking an out of focus photo of nessie now .I remember a photo from 1989 when the gentleman revealed he was a very experienced photographer and when it came out that he was using on of the latest Nikon autofocus slr cameras and couldn't get a decent photo i was rather amused.I have no doubt that something every now and again enters the loch via the sea and is seen once in a blue moon most eyewitness accounts I think are hoaxes.

[Amanda]

Ghostly happenings...

Has anyone on here actually seen a ghost?

There have been a few sinister deaths in my house (the last one being fifty years before I bought it, might I add, my husband is NOT under the patio!!).
Every night we hear strange things and items get moved around in my study.
However, we've never actually seen anything.

Amanda

[Scorpio]

I would love to witness paranormal activity. Have you ever thought about recording these phenomena?. A camera, and audio recording equipment is easy enough to get hold of.

[Rosella]

I have an open mind towards ghosts and the paranormal, though I've never seen anything myself. An American friend has a daughter who is a scientist. The daughter was in a neighbour's basement one day and saw a full blown phantom of her neighbour's husband gazing and smiling at her. He'd been dead for about 18 months at that time. It changed her life as she had been a sceptic about the paranormal up to that point.

Here in Australia another friend moved into a house which had a large closet in the spare bedroom. Every time she put items in it the hairs on the back of her neck stood up and she felt cold. After she'd been in the house for three months someone told her the previous tenant's adult son had hung himself in the closet.

[Amanda]

Results....

I would love to witness paranormal activity. Have you ever thought about recording these phenomena?. A camera, and audio recording equipment is easy enough to get hold of.

Hi Scorpio,
One night my friend brought her dual baby monitors over, so we put one in my study & took the other one downstairs with us. They weren't hi-tech but had a black & white screen which was pretty clear.
Nothing happened for hours and then I had to pop upstairs to the loo, whereby I had to walk past the door of my study (it was closed). As soon as I approached the top of the staircase, my friend saw bright orbs dancing all over the monitor screen. As soon as I returned downstairs they disappeared. We took turns going upstairs every fifteen minutes after that & each time the orbs would appear very clearly. As the door was firmly closed we couldn't explain it.

As for recording the weird happenings in the room, I'm a bit worried that we might 'disturb' whatever it is. After all Ive still got to live here. Thinking of moving in a couple of years, so might try to record it before I go.
Not saying I fully believe in ghosts but there's definitely something going on.
Amanda