Casebook: Jack the Ripper - Main
   

Introduction
Victims
Suspects
Witnesses
Ripper Letters
Police Officials
Official Documents
Press Reports
Victorian London
Message Boards
Ripper Media
Authors
Dissertations
Timelines
Games & Diversions
Photo Archive
Ripper Wiki
Casebook Examiner
Ripper Podcast
About the Casebook

Most Recent Posts:
Scene of the Crimes: Was Whitechapel really any worse than other areas of London? - by MrBarnett 1 hour and 17 minutes ago.
Scene of the Crimes: Was Whitechapel really any worse than other areas of London? - by miss marple 2 hours ago.
Doctors and Coroners: Eddowes' gut cut - by Sam Flynn 3 hours ago.
Doctors and Coroners: Eddowes' gut cut - by Fisherman 4 hours ago.
A6 Murders: scan of Hanratty statement re Rhyl alibi - by Spitfire 9 hours ago.
Doctors and Coroners: Eddowes' gut cut - by Joshua Rogan 9 hours ago.

Most Popular Threads:
Maybrick, James: Diary Handwriting - (25 posts)
Doctors and Coroners: Eddowes' gut cut - (14 posts)
Maybrick, James: Acquiring A Victorian Diary - (10 posts)
A6 Murders: scan of Hanratty statement re Rhyl alibi - (5 posts)
Scene of the Crimes: Was Whitechapel really any worse than other areas of London? - (4 posts)
Shades of Whitechapel: Dennis Nilsen - (4 posts)

Wiki Updates:
Robert Sagar
Edit: Chris
May 9, 2015, 12:32 am
Online newspaper archives
Edit: Chris
Nov 26, 2014, 10:25 am
Joseph Lawende
Edit: Chris
Mar 9, 2014, 10:12 am
Miscellaneous research resources
Edit: Chris
Feb 13, 2014, 9:28 am
Charles Cross
Edit: John Bennett
Sep 4, 2013, 8:20 pm

Most Recent Blogs:
Mike Covell: A DECADE IN THE MAKING.
February 19, 2016, 11:12 am.
Chris George: RipperCon in Baltimore, April 8-10, 2016
February 10, 2016, 2:55 pm.
Mike Covell: Hull Prison Visit
October 10, 2015, 8:04 am.
Mike Covell: NEW ADVENTURES IN RESEARCH
August 9, 2015, 3:10 am.
Mike Covell: UPDDATES FOR THE PAST 11 MONTHS
November 14, 2014, 10:02 am.
Mike Covell: Mike’s Book Releases
March 17, 2014, 3:18 am.

Go Back   Casebook Forums > Ripper Discussions > Suspects > Maybrick, James

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #881  
Old 02-04-2018, 04:59 AM
Iconoclast Iconoclast is offline
Sergeant
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Posts: 802
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by John Wheat View Post
I agree Abby it's up to those that don't believe the Diary was written by Mike to come up with proof of it and it is certainly up to those who believe Maybrick wrote the diary to prove it. As it stands there is no evidence that Mike didn't write the diary.

Cheers John
This is like the old "Is the glass half full or half empty?" conundrum (you know - the one where everyone always says they approach things with the former psychological predisposition when in reality those around them know it's the latter?).

Anyway, the answer to that conundrum is, of course, "Yes on both counts".

Similarly, it is not solely 'down to' pro-Maybrick supporters to prove Maybrick wrote the journal nor on Barrett-detractors to prove that he did not.

It is for all of us to prove our case and find the evidence to support that case. "Should the journal be proven authentic or proven a fake?". Yes on both counts, Your Honour.
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
  #882  
Old 02-04-2018, 05:00 AM
David Orsam David Orsam is offline
Commisioner
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 7,839
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by John G View Post
Okay, so it appears I misunderstood. But now there's something else I don't understand. Why do you say Mike wrote the diary if you're not sure whether he carried out any research?
I guess you haven't been following this thread very closely John. In #322 I said:

"Let me first correct the mistaken claim that I believe that Mike concocted the diary. This is something I have never said. What I have said is that Mike's acquisition of the Victorian Diary leads me to the conclusion that he was involved in forging the diary. That involvement could have been no more than obtaining the scrapbook (or not even that, simply an attempt to obtain a diary of some sort which the forger could use). Someone else might have concocted the text and someone else might have written it (and someone else might have obtained the scrapbook). Indeed, in his January 1995 affidavit, Mike claimed that Tony Devereux was involved in the preparations and research of the diary while his wife was the scribe who actually wrote it out based on some kind of pre-prepared draft or notes."


In any case, Melvin Harris has demonstrated very well that the amount of research required to produce the Diary was minimal if any:

http://www.casebook.org/dissertation...y/mhguide.html

Quote:
Originally Posted by John G View Post
By the way, as an aside I believe it's been stated that Mike was a journalist. Is there any evidence for this?
Yes, a number of articles published under his name in Celebrity magazine between 1986 and 1988.
__________________
Orsam Books
www.orsam.co.uk
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
  #883  
Old 02-04-2018, 05:02 AM
Iconoclast Iconoclast is offline
Sergeant
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Posts: 802
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by David Orsam View Post
Yes, a number of articles published under his name in Celebrity magazine between 1986 and 1988.
Wow, your glass is seriously half full, my dear Lord Orsam!
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
  #884  
Old 02-04-2018, 05:07 AM
John Wheat John Wheat is offline
Chief Inspector
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 1,725
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Iconoclast View Post
This is like the old "Is the glass half full or half empty?" conundrum (you know - the one where everyone always says they approach things with the former psychological predisposition when in reality those around them know it's the latter?).

Anyway, the answer to that conundrum is, of course, "Yes on both counts".

Similarly, it is not solely 'down to' pro-Maybrick supporters to prove Maybrick wrote the journal nor on Barrett-detractors to prove that he did not.

It is for all of us to prove our case and find the evidence to support that case. "Should the journal be proven authentic or proven a fake?". Yes on both counts, Your Honour.
No it really is up to those who believe the diary was written by Maybrick to prove it. There is no evidence that he did.
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
  #885  
Old 02-04-2018, 05:08 AM
David Orsam David Orsam is offline
Commisioner
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 7,839
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Iconoclast View Post
Wow, your glass is seriously half full, my dear Lord Orsam!
I don't even know what that means. It's a fact that he had articles published in his name in Celebrity.
__________________
Orsam Books
www.orsam.co.uk
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
  #886  
Old 02-04-2018, 06:08 AM
Abby Normal Abby Normal is offline
Commisioner
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 5,951
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by David Orsam View Post
I don't even know what that means. It's a fact that he had articles published in his name in Celebrity.
Itís supposed to mean your an optimist, but makes no sense in this context as you were simply stating a simple fact.
__________________
"Is all that we see or seem
but a dream within a dream?"

-Edgar Allan Poe


"...the man and the peaked cap he is said to have worn
quite tallies with the descriptions I got of him."

-Frederick G. Abberline
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
  #887  
Old 02-04-2018, 06:13 AM
David Orsam David Orsam is offline
Commisioner
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 7,839
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Abby Normal View Post
Itís supposed to mean your an optimist, but makes no sense in this context as you were simply stating a simple fact.
Yes, indeed, it was the context that baffled me. I was accurately reporting the water content of the glass in response to a question from John that could be translated as "Is there any water in the glass?".
__________________
Orsam Books
www.orsam.co.uk
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
  #888  
Old 02-04-2018, 06:31 AM
Iconoclast Iconoclast is offline
Sergeant
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Posts: 802
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by David Orsam View Post
Yes, indeed, it was the context that baffled me. I was accurately reporting the water content of the glass in response to a question from John that could be translated as "Is there any water in the glass?".
Wow - here's another one for you guys ... navel-gazing ad absurdum!

Honestly, you don't need to argue everything you lot!

The good Lord's optimism (thank you AN) lay in his generous reference to Barrett as a 'journalist'.

A few articles and the odd crossword does not a journalist make, methinks!

Does a few drops of water a glass of water make???

Last edited by Iconoclast : 02-04-2018 at 06:34 AM.
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
  #889  
Old 02-04-2018, 06:40 AM
David Orsam David Orsam is offline
Commisioner
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 7,839
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Iconoclast View Post
A few articles and the odd crossword does not a journalist make, methinks!
I didn't mention a crossword.

The question was: Is there "any evidence" Mike was a journalist?

The fact that he had articles published under his byline in a nationally sold magazine by a well known publisher over a three year period and was paid for those articles must, by any definition, be evidence that he was a freelance journalist.
__________________
Orsam Books
www.orsam.co.uk
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
  #890  
Old 02-04-2018, 06:43 AM
Iconoclast Iconoclast is offline
Sergeant
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Posts: 802
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by David Orsam View Post
I didn't mention a crossword.

The question was: Is there "any evidence" Mike was a journalist?

The fact that he had articles published under his byline in a nationally sold magazine by a well known publisher over a three year period and was paid for those articles must, by any definition, be evidence that he was a freelance journalist.
Why does it need to be you who mentions it? Barrett the author-scrap dealer submitted crosswords as well. I don't recall the details.

Your use of 'journalist' gives credibility to Maybrick where truthfully none can lie. It inflates him, as I suspect it is intended to do.
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 02:27 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.