Casebook: Jack the Ripper - Main
   

Introduction
Victims
Suspects
Witnesses
Ripper Letters
Police Officials
Official Documents
Press Reports
Victorian London
Message Boards
Ripper Media
Authors
Dissertations
Timelines
Games & Diversions
Photo Archive
Ripper Wiki
Casebook Examiner
Ripper Podcast
About the Casebook

Most Recent Posts:
Maybrick, James: 25 YEARS OF THE DIARY OF JACK THE RIPPER: THE TRUE FACTS by Robert Smith - by Observer 9 minutes ago.
Maybrick, James: 25 YEARS OF THE DIARY OF JACK THE RIPPER: THE TRUE FACTS by Robert Smith - by Sam Flynn 13 minutes ago.
Maybrick, James: 25 YEARS OF THE DIARY OF JACK THE RIPPER: THE TRUE FACTS by Robert Smith - by Observer 31 minutes ago.
Maybrick, James: 25 YEARS OF THE DIARY OF JACK THE RIPPER: THE TRUE FACTS by Robert Smith - by Simon Wood 6 hours ago.
Maybrick, James: 25 YEARS OF THE DIARY OF JACK THE RIPPER: THE TRUE FACTS by Robert Smith - by rjpalmer 7 hours ago.
Other: Ripper Novel? - by WastelandOfTheRipper 7 hours ago.

Most Popular Threads:
General Police Discussion: Kelly inquest/Smithkey - (32 posts)
Maybrick, James: 25 YEARS OF THE DIARY OF JACK THE RIPPER: THE TRUE FACTS by Robert Smith - (20 posts)
Other: Ripper Novel? - (12 posts)
General Police Discussion: Leaving one's beat - (7 posts)
General Suspect Discussion: Strictly personal ID - (6 posts)
Witnesses: Value of a lie - (4 posts)

Wiki Updates:
Robert Sagar
Edit: Chris
May 9, 2015, 12:32 am
Online newspaper archives
Edit: Chris
Nov 26, 2014, 10:25 am
Joseph Lawende
Edit: Chris
Mar 9, 2014, 10:12 am
Miscellaneous research resources
Edit: Chris
Feb 13, 2014, 9:28 am
Charles Cross
Edit: John Bennett
Sep 4, 2013, 8:20 pm

Most Recent Blogs:
Mike Covell: A DECADE IN THE MAKING.
February 19, 2016, 11:12 am.
Chris George: RipperCon in Baltimore, April 8-10, 2016
February 10, 2016, 2:55 pm.
Mike Covell: Hull Prison Visit
October 10, 2015, 8:04 am.
Mike Covell: NEW ADVENTURES IN RESEARCH
August 9, 2015, 3:10 am.
Mike Covell: UPDDATES FOR THE PAST 11 MONTHS
November 14, 2014, 10:02 am.
Mike Covell: Mike’s Book Releases
March 17, 2014, 3:18 am.

Go Back   Casebook Forums > Ripper Discussions > Letters and Communications > Goulston Street Graffito

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #1  
Old 08-12-2017, 01:56 AM
Herlock Sholmes Herlock Sholmes is offline
Sergeant
 
Join Date: May 2017
Location: The West Midlands
Posts: 568
Default Can we profile the Ripper from the GSG?

I don't foresee this as a long thread but I thought that I'd try and get a few opinions. I imagine that if we took a poll asking if the GSG was written by Jack or not that the 'nots' would win? Possibly even by a significant margin. I've always leaned toward the opinion that it was. I'm a little like Cadosche though; just on the other side of the fence. So perhaps I should have called this thread 'can we profile the writer of the GSG?'

My point is one that I imagine has been made before, more than once, so apologies for going over old ground but hey, this is a forum about 1888 after all!

A thing that's always interested in me and I've wondered if it's at all suggestive is the fact that the writer managed to spell 'blamed' and 'nothing' correctly whilst mis-spelling the word 'Jews.' With the double negative hinting at a not-so-good grasp of basic grammar and the spelling of 'juwes' showing poor spelling the impression that we get is of someone of poor education. But if he could spell two tricky words correctly and yet get a simpler one wrong are we dealing with someone trying to downplay or hide his level of education? If so, then surely someone would only do that if they felt that their level of education was considerably above that of an average Whitechapel resident? The writing was also said to be in a good schoolboy hand hinting at decent penmanship.

So what can we deduce if anything?

Could the spelling of 'juwes' have been a deliberate insult. An example of 'I'm not even going to spell your name correctly.' Like someone talking to Nigel Farrage but pronouncing his surname to rhyme with marriage instead of barrage as an insult.

Was Jack a decently educated man who had come down in the world? Perhaps someone who blamed the Jews and prostitutes for the degraded area in which he was forced to live? Perhaps he felt that the Jews never received any blame for the 'harm' that they had caused? Perhaps the double negative is also mocking local speech and the locals poor education? So can we also see a man who sees himself as superior to those around him. Someone to whom fate has been cruel?

Someone who felt justified in taking revenge?
__________________
Regards

Herlock






"When you eliminate the impossible, whatever remains no matter how improbable........is probably a bit boring!"
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 08-12-2017, 02:05 AM
GUT GUT is offline
Commisioner
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: I come from a land Down Under
Posts: 7,071
Default

Well the real answer is, who knows if he was educated or not.

I'm reasonably well educated, but spell some words wrong all the time, I know people who gave little education but spell perfectly.
__________________
G U T

There are two ways to be fooled, one is to believe what isn't true, the other is to refuse to believe that which is true.
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 08-12-2017, 02:12 AM
Sam Flynn Sam Flynn is online now
Casebook Supporter
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Wales
Posts: 7,908
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Herlock Sholmes View Post
I imagine that if we took a poll asking if the GSG was written by Jack or not that the 'nots' would win? Possibly even by a significant margin.
I wouldn't be surprised if it came out closer to 50:50 - the GSG still pretty much divides opinion.
Quote:
A thing that's always interested in me and I've wondered if it's at all suggestive is the fact that the writer managed to spell 'blamed' and 'nothing' correctly whilst mis-spelling the word 'Jews.'
The odd thing about that is that, given the substantial input that religious charitable movements had on improving working-class literacy (Sunday Schools, the various temperance movements, Christian charities etc), as well as the preponderance of Jewish immigrants on the streets of Whitechapel and stories about them in the press, I'd have expected that it was within the grasp of most people to spell the word "Jews" correctly. Perhaps it wasn't so much a mis-spelling, as a mis-reading?
__________________
Kind regards, Sam Flynn

"Suche Nullen" (Nietzsche, Götzendämmerung, 1888)
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 08-12-2017, 02:31 AM
GUT GUT is offline
Commisioner
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: I come from a land Down Under
Posts: 7,071
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sam Flynn View Post
I wouldn't be surprised if it came out closer to 50:50 - the GSG still pretty much divides opinion.The odd thing about that is that, given the substantial input that religious charitable movements had on improving working-class literacy (Sunday Schools, the various temperance movements, Christian charities etc), as well as the preponderance of Jewish immigrants on the streets of Whitechapel and stories about them in the press, I'd have expected that it was within the grasp of most people to spell the word "Jews" correctly. Perhaps it wasn't so much a mis-spelling, as a mis-reading?
I wouldn't rule out a mis-reading either.
__________________
G U T

There are two ways to be fooled, one is to believe what isn't true, the other is to refuse to believe that which is true.
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 08-12-2017, 02:32 AM
FrankO FrankO is offline
Sergeant
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: The Netherlands
Posts: 777
Default

Here are a couple of my thoughs, Micheal:
  • The graffito has always struck me as a rather roundabout way of saying something
  • My take is that it’s supposed to mean that we shouldn’t blame the Jews without good reason
  • Which makes the graffito like a punishment line that children write at school

All the best,
Frank
__________________
"You can rob me, you can starve me and you can beat me and you can kill me. Just don't bore me."
Clint Eastwood as Gunny in "Heartbreak Ridge"
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 08-12-2017, 02:39 AM
Herlock Sholmes Herlock Sholmes is offline
Sergeant
 
Join Date: May 2017
Location: The West Midlands
Posts: 568
Default

A mid-reading is always a possibility of course. You would have thought though with the number of people seeing it you would get a reasonable consensus. The point doesn't alter if it was written juews. Something about the spelling appeared to draw attention? Maybe?
__________________
Regards

Herlock






"When you eliminate the impossible, whatever remains no matter how improbable........is probably a bit boring!"
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 08-12-2017, 03:17 AM
Sam Flynn Sam Flynn is online now
Casebook Supporter
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Wales
Posts: 7,908
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Herlock Sholmes View Post
A mis-reading is always a possibility of course. You would have thought though with the number of people seeing it you would get a reasonable consensus.
This is perhaps where the mis-reading hypothesis gains a little support. If one source said that it was "Jews", but others said "Juwes" or even "Jewes" (etc), it could simply have been a case of an ambiguous visual stimulus being interpreted differently. It might just have been a wonkily-written (but correctly-spelt) "Jews" all along.
__________________
Kind regards, Sam Flynn

"Suche Nullen" (Nietzsche, Götzendämmerung, 1888)
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 08-12-2017, 03:42 AM
Harry D Harry D is offline
Chief Inspector
 
Join Date: May 2014
Posts: 1,854
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by FrankO View Post
My take is that it’s supposed to mean that we shouldn’t blame the Jews without good reason
I beg to differ. I think the author is implying that Jews don't take responsibility for their actions, a mindset that is still prevalent in antisemitic circles today. Martin Fido took this interpretation as the basis for his 'ripped off customer' theory. However, I think the author might have meant it in a general sense, perhaps even religiously, i.e. the Jews won't accept the blame for killing Christ.
__________________
Hail to the king, baby!
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 08-12-2017, 04:05 AM
Sam Flynn Sam Flynn is online now
Casebook Supporter
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Wales
Posts: 7,908
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Harry D View Post
However, I think the author might have meant it in a general sense, perhaps even religiously, i.e. the Jews won't accept the blame for killing Christ.
I was in Christ Church, Spitalfields only yesterday - the first time I've actually been inside, believe it or not, despite umpteen visits to Whitechapel. I was amazed to find the lobby full of memorial plaques to those preachers and missionaries of Christ Church devoted to missionary work among the Jews of the area. (Christ Church seems to have served as a "base" for Christian missionaries to the Jews.) One plaque mentioned the good work of one proselyte to work with the Jews to put right the "wrongs of centuries", or words to that effect. I took "the wrongs of centuries" as a specific, if veiled, reference to the Jews' "complicity" in the crucifixion. A small shudder went up my spine.
__________________
Kind regards, Sam Flynn

"Suche Nullen" (Nietzsche, Götzendämmerung, 1888)

Last edited by Sam Flynn : 08-12-2017 at 04:07 AM.
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 08-12-2017, 05:25 AM
Robert Robert is online now
Casebook Supporter
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 4,637
Default

A small shudder went up my spine.

You were expecting the imminent appearance of "The Diary of Caiaphas."
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 03:14 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.