Kosminski and Victim DNA Match on Shawl - Part 2

[Observer]

I think you'd need to take the best of three. Or maybe the best of five. Is five enough, though?

We'd need a Professor of Statistics to tell us that, wouldn't we? Or maybe three, just to be on the safe side. Or maybe five ...

It's finally beginning to sink in with you people. I like the bit about the statistician's.

[Observer]

Hello Observer,

So what is wrong with other people, other than qualified experts, telling him?... Ummm.. if most of the people telling David Moyes had been listened too last year by David Moyes, Man Utd may have had a better season... and they weren't other managers.. but people who know football. To them they SAW the mistakes as clear as daylight. Moyes did not. But they tried to tell him. They weren't experts... but they were right... and had the right to point out his errors too.


regards

Phil

Moyes mistakes were multiple Phil. What we have here is a single very basic very uncharacteristic mistake for an expert in the field to make. Was it he who made the mistake which appears in the book?

[tji]

If, if, if. You're full of if's. Is it Dr J's mistake which appears in the book?

Well Observer, what would you prefer me be full of?

I think he would be hollering from the rooftop's if not, don't you?

Tj

[Gene Lewis]

The news is that his shop is closing,as it was on a six month lease..

Closing and double-locked, it seems… as it was last saturday afternoon.

[Monty]

Thanks, Tracy.

Perhaps I should also make it clear that when I spoke to Russell Edwards last year it was on condition that what he told me would remain confidential, which it did.

But after the news broke I did mention to a number of people privately (including Tracy) what my involvement had been, and I also mentioned quite soon after that on part 1 of this thread that I could confirm the genealogical connection of 'M' with Aaron Kozminski, and that Russell Edwards wasn't provided with her contact details until after the date given in the book for the extraction of the material from the shawl.

So there's certainly been no concealment.

I can confim that, and edorse Traceys post.

Chris has been nothing but professional, honest and generous in our dealings with each other.

Monty

[Robert]

How on earth did this come round to taking a swipe at Chris?

"He's that swot who keeps finding out things. Let's get him at playtime."

[mickreed]

Y
So as far as I can see we still have a large number of different 'expert' opinions, which should really be fairly easy to clarify?

Hey Jeff,

I would imagine that only a physical examination of the actual item by a number of independent experts, who are not asked leading questions, like, 'could this come from Russia?', would be acceptable.

If Edwards will permit the shawl to be so examined, then I, for one, might feel less sceptical about him. And, to be fair, maybe he will. Let's see. It's his property and it's obviously up to him.

All I can say is, unless he does allow the item to be analysed by an impartial group of experts, then his work is never likely to be of any real value, except, possibly to his bank account.

[mickreed]

How on earth did this come round to taking a swipe at Chris?

You've got me beat, Robert.

[Patrick S]

Hey Jeff,

I would imagine that only a physical examination of the actual item by a number of independent experts, who are not asked leading questions, like, 'could this come from Russia?', would be acceptable.

If Edwards will permit the shawl to be so examined, then I, for one, might feel less sceptical about him. And, to be fair, maybe he will. Let's see. It's his property and it's obviously up to him.

All I can say is, unless he does allow the item to be analysed by an impartial group of experts, then his work is never likely to be of any real value, except, possibly to his bank account.

This thread (now threads) has gone round and round. Yet, every few days we get to the nub of it, as Mick has here: Have patience.

It's an excellent, entertaining, and (often) enlightening topic for (occasionally productive) conversation. But, in the end we must come back to reality: As of now it's fairly impossible to judge the validity of the shawl, Edwards claims, Dr. J's processes and results.

As far as the science goes, we are forced to rely on opinion from other "experts" who either refute of support the science. Still, Dr. J is, himself an expert, isn't he? So it's really all a matter of which expert you choose to believe. At this point, this thing is akin to placing a wager on a horse. We're in mid-race. At some point they'll come down the stretch and we'll have a winner. To beat this analogy to death....Some races are easy picks. I put my money against Cornwell before I even read her book. I cashed my ticket after finishing it when she failed to convince, not only me, but all those whose opinions I'd come to respect. No wagers for me on this one. I'm sitting this race out. That is to say (and now I'm trampling on the corpse of this analogy), I don't have a horse in this race.

[lynn cates]

scarfing it down

Hello Patrick. I have heard that it is no longer shawl, dress nor table runner. It now seems to be a scarf.

Cheers.
LC

[Debra A]

I can confim that, and edorse Traceys post.

Chris has been nothing but professional, honest and generous in our dealings with each other.

Monty

Absolutely.
Personally speaking, Chris has been upfront the whole way through this with me. I knew about Chris's involvement with tracing a descendant but he didn't go into details about it and I didn't ask because I trust him implicitly.

[Patrick S]

Hello Patrick. I have heard that it is no longer shawl, dress nor table runner. It now seems to be a scarf.

Cheers.
LC

Well. That changes everything, Lynn.......FRAUD!!!!!!!

[Jeff Leahy]

Hey Jeff,

I would imagine that only a physical examination of the actual item by a number of independent experts, who are not asked leading questions, like, 'could this come from Russia?', would be acceptable.

If Edwards will permit the shawl to be so examined, then I, for one, might feel less sceptical about him. And, to be fair, maybe he will. Let's see. It's his property and it's obviously up to him.

All I can say is, unless he does allow the item to be analysed by an impartial group of experts, then his work is never likely to be of any real value, except, possibly to his bank account.

Unfortunately I'm not an expert to know which experts would be best in this case. But if anybody wishes to suggest someone and PM me their name, I'll ask if this would be possible.

It could be that Edwards is already under contact and be unable to co-operate even if he was willing to do so.

I guess we could approach the Parlours or one of the people who own alternative framed sections. Do we know how many shawl pieces exist and who owns them?

Yours Jeff

[AdamNeilWood]

The questioning of Chris' involvement with Russell Edwards' book is absolutely ridiculous.

If he or anyone else knew they'd face an inquisition every time they offered help or information to an author not much would get written.

[Patrick S]

The questioning of Chris' involvement with Russell Edwards' book is absolutely ridiculous.

If he or anyone else knew they'd face an inquisition every time they offered help or information to an author not much would get written.

I'm a bit confused, as well. Is this not what we should expect writers to do? Shouldn't they seek the input of those with valuable informaiton and/or research to contribute?