Casebook: Jack the Ripper - Main
   

Introduction
Victims
Suspects
Witnesses
Ripper Letters
Police Officials
Official Documents
Press Reports
Victorian London
Message Boards
Ripper Media
Authors
Dissertations
Timelines
Games & Diversions
Photo Archive
Ripper Wiki
Casebook Examiner
Ripper Podcast
About the Casebook

Most Recent Posts:
Goulston Street Graffito: The GSG - Did Jack write it? POLL - by Trevor Marriott 8 minutes ago.
Tumblety, Francis: Tumblety - Hermaphrodite. - by Steadmund Brand 11 minutes ago.
Tumblety, Francis: Tumblety - Hermaphrodite. - by Sam Flynn 43 minutes ago.
Tumblety, Francis: Tumblety - Hermaphrodite. - by DirectorDave 53 minutes ago.
Goulston Street Graffito: The GSG - Did Jack write it? POLL - by Elamarna 1 hour and 20 minutes ago.
Tumblety, Francis: Tumblety - Hermaphrodite. - by Steadmund Brand 1 hour and 22 minutes ago.

Most Popular Threads:
Goulston Street Graffito: The GSG - Did Jack write it? POLL - (47 posts)
Tumblety, Francis: Tumblety - Hermaphrodite. - (7 posts)
General Letters or Communications: The GOGMAGOG-letter - (5 posts)
Lechmere/Cross, Charles: Lechmere a witness to the killer - (4 posts)
Mary Jane Kelly: Why Mary had to die. - (4 posts)
General Victim Discussion: What does this picture remind you of? - (4 posts)

Wiki Updates:
Robert Sagar
Edit: Chris
May 9, 2015, 12:32 am
Online newspaper archives
Edit: Chris
Nov 26, 2014, 10:25 am
Joseph Lawende
Edit: Chris
Mar 9, 2014, 10:12 am
Miscellaneous research resources
Edit: Chris
Feb 13, 2014, 9:28 am
Charles Cross
Edit: John Bennett
Sep 4, 2013, 8:20 pm

Most Recent Blogs:
Mike Covell: A DECADE IN THE MAKING.
February 19, 2016, 11:12 am.
Chris George: RipperCon in Baltimore, April 8-10, 2016
February 10, 2016, 2:55 pm.
Mike Covell: Hull Prison Visit
October 10, 2015, 8:04 am.
Mike Covell: NEW ADVENTURES IN RESEARCH
August 9, 2015, 3:10 am.
Mike Covell: UPDDATES FOR THE PAST 11 MONTHS
November 14, 2014, 10:02 am.
Mike Covell: Mike’s Book Releases
March 17, 2014, 3:18 am.

Go Back   Casebook Forums > Ripper Discussions > General Discussion

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #11  
Old 12-19-2016, 01:03 PM
Wickerman Wickerman is offline
Commisioner
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 8,683
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by David Orsam View Post
See the building labelled 'P.O' on this map.
Yes David, that map identifies the later location - above the 'e' in Aldgate.
The Post Office location at 19/20 Aldgate is on the corner of Duke & Aldgate - above the 2nd 'a' in Aldgate.
I can't get my Photobucket to work to post the Goad map.
__________________
Regards, Jon S.
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 12-19-2016, 02:19 PM
Joshua Rogan Joshua Rogan is online now
Inspector
 
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 1,308
Default

Wow, thanks everyone!
First off, are Aldgate and High Street two separate addresses, rather than one? I've been assuming they were, but I guess not.

I think the Post Office locations are clear on these two maps, unfortunately I seem to lack the ability to clip and resize them so they can be uploaded.

1887 Goad
http://britishlibrary.georeferencer....2Wal/visualize

1894 ORdnance Survey
http://maps.nls.uk/geo/explore/#zoom...layers=163&b=1

The Goad map shows a couple of warehouses near no.2 High Street, and also handy skylights which may have been the means of entry. There seems to be an empty lot at the back, however by 1894 there are a couple of buildings there between Duke St and Hanover Place. If these had just been built in 1888, could they be the empty buildings where the thieves got in?

That's if I understand your post correctly Debs, that the move must have happened sometime in 1888?
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 12-19-2016, 02:35 PM
Wickerman Wickerman is offline
Commisioner
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 8,683
Default

See if this works...

__________________
Regards, Jon S.
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 12-19-2016, 02:41 PM
Joshua Rogan Joshua Rogan is online now
Inspector
 
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 1,308
Default

By Jove, I think you've cracked it!
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 12-19-2016, 02:52 PM
Wickerman Wickerman is offline
Commisioner
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 8,683
Default

The press accounts state that:
- A Warehouse was behind the P.O.
- this warehouse had an address on Duke Street.
- access to the P.O. was gained through a trap door on the roof, not a sky-light.

No.52 Duke St. was directly behind the P.O. it was not a dwelling (D), but a shop (S), and it was empty. So it must have been used for storage - ie; warehouse.
As Debs pointed out, Lewis Myers owned both the P.O. at 19/20 Aldgate, and No. 52 Duke St., behind the P.O. - the empty shop.

The site at No.2 Aldgate High St. has no premises behind it which are on Duke st., so I think the corner premises at 19/20 Aldgate is the Post Office in question that was burgled.
__________________
Regards, Jon S.

Last edited by Wickerman : 12-19-2016 at 02:56 PM.
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 12-19-2016, 03:10 PM
Debra A Debra A is offline
Superintendent
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Yorkshire England
Posts: 2,817
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Joshua Rogan View Post
Wow, thanks everyone!
First off, are Aldgate and High Street two separate addresses, rather than one? I've been assuming they were, but I guess not.

I think the Post Office locations are clear on these two maps, unfortunately I seem to lack the ability to clip and resize them so they can be uploaded.

1887 Goad
http://britishlibrary.georeferencer....2Wal/visualize

1894 ORdnance Survey
http://maps.nls.uk/geo/explore/#zoom...layers=163&b=1

The Goad map shows a couple of warehouses near no.2 High Street, and also handy skylights which may have been the means of entry. There seems to be an empty lot at the back, however by 1894 there are a couple of buildings there between Duke St and Hanover Place. If these had just been built in 1888, could they be the empty buildings where the thieves got in?

That's if I understand your post correctly Debs, that the move must have happened sometime in 1888?
Yes, it looks like it may have moved some time in 88 according to the land tax records, Joshua. I don't know exactly when in 1888 though.

The property listed with occupiers Eliza Jones &postmaster general in 1887 and just Eliza Jones in 88 (no mention of the post) was 19/20 Aldgate, as Simon posted. Aldgate High St was a continuation of Aldgate. No. 52 Duke St (empty) was owned by Lewis Harris in 1888 as was No. 19/20 Aldgate.

No 2 Aldgate High St a couple of doors down was not listed as a post office in 87 but was in 88/89.
__________________
,,`,, Debs ,,`,,
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 12-19-2016, 03:17 PM
Debra A Debra A is offline
Superintendent
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Yorkshire England
Posts: 2,817
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wickerman View Post
The press accounts state that:
- A Warehouse was behind the P.O.
- this warehouse had an address on Duke Street.
- access to the P.O. was gained through a trap door on the roof, not a sky-light.

No.52 Duke St. was directly behind the P.O. it was not a dwelling (D), but a shop (S), and it was empty. So it must have been used for storage - ie; warehouse.
As Debs pointed out, Lewis Myers owned both the P.O. at 19/20 Aldgate, and No. 52 Duke St., behind the P.O. - the empty shop.

The site at No.2 Aldgate High St. has no premises behind it which are on Duke st., so I think the corner premises at 19/20 Aldgate is the Post Office in question that was burgled.
I think you are right, Jon.
The Land Tax Register assesments were for the year 1888, ending 24th March 1889 so the change in address could have been any time up to that date.
__________________
,,`,, Debs ,,`,,
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 12-19-2016, 03:44 PM
Wickerman Wickerman is offline
Commisioner
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 8,683
Default

Perhaps it was the predictably easy access to the existing P.O. (ie; this burglary) that persuaded the authorities to relocate the P.O.?
__________________
Regards, Jon S.
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 12-19-2016, 04:05 PM
Joshua Rogan Joshua Rogan is online now
Inspector
 
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 1,308
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Debra A View Post
I think you are right, Jon.
The Land Tax Register assesments were for the year 1888, ending 24th March 1889 so the change in address could have been any time up to that date.
Does that work the other way around? That is, if the original PO isn't listed in the 1888 register, it must have moved by 24th March 1888?
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 12-19-2016, 04:06 PM
Joshua Rogan Joshua Rogan is online now
Inspector
 
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 1,308
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wickerman View Post
Perhaps it was the predictably easy access to the existing P.O. (ie; this burglary) that persuaded the authorities to relocate the P.O.?
That's a very good point!
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 08:07 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.