Sherlock Holmes vs Jack the Ripper

[thomatofletchup]

Hi,

My first post -

I'm doing a dissertation on the repackaging of nineteenth century brands, my argument being that Holmes and the Ripper became brands and with all the tv shows and films about them etc being modernised or adapted, why is it that these two characters are so popular?

Any thoughts?

Much obliged

[lynn cates]

intellect

Hello Thom. Welcome to the boards.

A guess in answer to your question might be that both were conceived as intellectually superior to the average person. So Holmes could look at a bit of ash from a cigar and decide from whence it came and who the smoker was.

The "Ripper" could kill, for example, Kate, whilst surrounded by police and the vigilance committee, then get away.

I suppose it would be a hunger for a certain intellectual type, then.

Good luck with the dissertation.

Cheers.
LC

[The Grave Maurice]

I've often wondered why they both continue to be so popular, too. With Holmes, I can see the appeal of the "cozy" nature of the stories. The good friends, Holmes and Watson, start out (typically) sitting by a fire at 221B, then head out into the cold, cruel world to solve an unsolvable puzzle, then return to the warmth of the hearth and a nice bit of grub. There's something that continues to be very comforting about that model and it still works as can be seen from the latest BBC adaptation and the success of the Robert Downey movies.

JtR somehow draws on the same source since many people are interested in both men, although one is fictional and one isn't. It must have something to do with the appeal of hansom cabs, gaslight, dark alleys and mystery but I can't identify what exactly. It's certainly too long ago to be attributed to nostalgia.

Anyway, welcome, and I hope you'll give us a link to your dissertation when it's completed. I like your screen name: I'm guessing your real name is probably something like Thomas Fletcher.

[lynn cates]

true character

Hello Ken.

"one is fictional and one isn't"

New one on me. I thought Sherlock Holmes was merely an inspiration in Sir Arthur's mind.

Never too old to learn.

Cheers.
LC

[Cogidubnus]

New one on me. I thought Sherlock Holmes was merely an inspiration in Sir Arthur's mind.

You're a dreadful tease Mr Cates!

Welcome to the boards Thom...

Dave

[The Grave Maurice]

I wish you hadn't drawn attention to my faux pas, Lynn. One of the cardinal rules of the "game" is that SH was a real person. I'm now probably in serious trouble with my Sherlockian friends in North America and my Holmesian friends in the UK.

[lynn cates]

blooper

Hello Ken. It's all in the game. (heh-heh)

Cheers.
LC

[Steven Russell]

Naughty Maurice. One reason for Holmes's popularity was that it was a new idea to write and publish (in The Strand magazine) a series of short, stand-alone stories centred on the same character. You could miss an issue and still enjoy the next one. Doyle himself believed that he was the first to do this. Holmes had appeared in two novels already but did not become a "hit" until the Adventures.

Plus there was Doyle's undoubted skill as a story teller. His publisher regarded him as "the greatest short story writer since Poe". Then there is the double act of Holmes and Watson. The suave but aloof and slightly misanthropic calculating machine, and his faithful chronicler - brave, honest, and chivalrous. There was much for the reader to admire in both but but their collective qualities would not have worked if given to a single character. There had been detective stories before but the Holmes tales were better than anything previous, and written purely with entertainment in mind. I don't think we would have had Morse, Poirot, Columbo, CSI and the rest without Holmes.

If Holmes "made" The Strand, then the popular press e.g. the recently formed Star newspaper profited greatly from the Ripper. Here was a truly horrific villain for the newly literate masses. He was a journalist's dream in that the facts of the crimes were so sensational as to need no exaggeration. Added to which, his unknown identity meant that the story could run and run with speculation and theories being legitimate copy.

Perhaps in a way, the Ripper helped Holmes as well. People embraced the super-hero of fiction (sorry, Maurice) as an antidote to the super-villain of reality (sorry, Lynn).

Best wishes and welcome,
Steve.

[halomanuk]

Holmes is good literature from the Victorian period,written at the time,and gives an insight into Victorian life and culture as much as anything else.
His popularity will not fade for that reason IMO.

[thomatofletchup]

Thanks guys for all your input!

I will let you know how I'm getting on with each chapter! I've submitted my intro but by uni regulations I don't think I'm allowed to post any of my actual work but know that my intro seems to have gone to plan!

Thanks Guys!