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Go Back   Casebook Forums > Social Chat > Other Mysteries > A6 Murders

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  #4611  
Old 03-17-2018, 07:56 AM
NickB NickB is offline
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Just a thought, but might the pom pom hat have been in Gregsten's bag of washing?

The inventory list Natalie posted does not appear to include these items.
http://forum.casebook.org/showthread...987#post244987
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  #4612  
Old 03-17-2018, 08:59 AM
Graham Graham is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NickB View Post
Just a thought, but might the pom pom hat have been in Gregsten's bag of washing?

The inventory list Natalie posted does not appear to include these items.
http://forum.casebook.org/showthread...987#post244987
Good thinking, Nick. Gregsten strikes me as being a far more likely wearer of such head-gear than Hanratty. However, in the total absence of any such hat, Mr Lee's statement must I think be questionable. Unless it was Hanratty that he saw, and that Hanratty got rid of the hat en route to London. Who knows?

I would guess that the bag of washing, the duffel bag, etc., were eventually passed on to Gregsten's nearest of kin.

Graham
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  #4613  
Old 03-17-2018, 01:34 PM
moste moste is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NickB View Post
Just a thought, but might the pom pom hat have been in Gregsten's bag of washing?

The inventory list Natalie posted does not appear to include these items.
http://forum.casebook.org/showthread...987#post244987
I wonder what item '34' is alluding to : Bullet from bank.
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  #4614  
Old 03-17-2018, 01:55 PM
moste moste is offline
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Item '5' Blood clot. as against 'blood sample', I mean to say I thought according to Storie there was large quantities of blood.
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  #4615  
Old 03-18-2018, 10:03 AM
Graham Graham is offline
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Originally Posted by moste View Post
I wonder what item '34' is alluding to : Bullet from bank.
I would say the bank adjacent to the lay-by.

Graham
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  #4616  
Old 03-18-2018, 10:29 AM
moste moste is offline
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Default Bobble Hats

Just browsing through a 1950s Daily Express sponsored National car rally event, and the journalist running through the hundred and fifty odd entrants and their motors , makes mention of a few of the drivers and co-pilots attire, (just to keep his run down of all competitors from becoming boring I suspect) and it seams the woolen, colourful, bobble hats were quite the norm at these events.
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  #4617  
Old 03-18-2018, 10:44 AM
moste moste is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Graham View Post
I would say the bank adjacent to the lay-by.

Graham
quite right as in 'embankment'

There was quite a rise in the edge of the laneway and it would appear also a thicket of bushes and shrubbery that the police had to have scythed,bullet discovered by use of metal detectors. Only one bullet though from those that missed
I wonder what kind of a view a passing motorist would have had from someone flat on their back waving a petticoat? very sad!

Last edited by moste : 03-18-2018 at 10:48 AM. Reason: add a sentence
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  #4618  
Old 03-19-2018, 08:45 AM
Alfie Alfie is offline
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Default Lennon-backed film: Did Britain Murder Hanratty?

Watched this over the weekend and was struck by how inaccurate and how misleading some of the claims made during it were (most made at a public meeting in Watford, Jan 1, 1969; see https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HGl9tzMNtpE):

"... many people at the time were very disturbed [by Hanratty's death sentence], and a large number of Members of Parliament urged the Home Secretary to recommend clemency." (this from the man introducing the A6 committee to the audience. Anybody know who he was?)

“He [JH] went to prison, I believe it was three times, for car thieving.” All the time it was for stealing cars? “Stealing cars, yes.” (James Hanratty, Sr)

"... we’ve been trying for a long long time to find out who this fellow is [who was wrongly identified by Storie]. We don’t know who he is. There’s a rumour that he’s a Spanish sailor. Lucky for him that he’s a Spanish sailor, because if he wasn’t a Spanish sailor, and if he hadn’t got an alibi, if he couldn’t remember where he was a month ago, he’d probably have been charged with the murder, he’d probably have been hung." (Paul Foot)

“Hanratty was the only cockney on the parade ..." (Jean Justice)

"The other fellow [Blackhall] says, ‘Definitely wasn’t Hanratty.’" (Foot)

"Another fellow going to work, bit of a fly boy, fellow called John Trower down in the East End. He’s, ah, easy with the police, you know, likes to keep in with the police, that kind of thing. ... he looks around, a car shoots by at 30 miles per hour. Now I don’t know if you’ve ever tried to identify a driver of a car going past you at 30 miles per hour at seven o’clock in the morning, and if you’ve tried it, well, it’s extremely difficult." (Foot; Trower testified at trial that the car was doing only 20mph)

Hanratty "wandered around looking for Tarlton or Talbot Road, where a previous prisoner friend of Hanratty was believed to live." (Foot; JH told Kleinman he was looking for Talbot or Carlton Road)

"Well, they [the police] come to a shop called Cowley’s, and there’s a man there, he says ‘Well, as a matter of fact I wasn’t here on that day, my, ah, sister, my mother, my mother-in-law was looking after the shop at the time. Perhaps you’d better go and see her.’ So they go and find the mother-in-law, who’s a very respectable lady called Mrs Dinwoodie." (Foot)

"Now they gave Mrs Dinwoodie a photograph of Hanratty and said, ‘Is this the man?’ And she said, ‘Certainly, that’s the man.’ And she signed on the back: ‘This is the man who came into my shop.’ The little girl, Barbara Ford there, they said, ‘Do you think that’s the man?’ She said, ‘Yes, that’s the man.’ Signed on the back." (Foot; in fact, Barbara Ford was not interviewed until Nov 2; She was shown some photographs but could not recognise any of them.)

"... everyone in the area knew that Gregsten and Valerie Storie used to go to that cornfield in that car. Night after night, night after night." (Foot)

The other striking thing for me was Foot's dogmatic, hectoring style of speaking. He seemed quite the opposite of the cool, dispassionate author of 'Who Killed Hanratty?'
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  #4619  
Old 03-19-2018, 09:31 AM
moste moste is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alfie View Post
Watched this over the weekend and was struck by how inaccurate and how misleading some of the claims made during it were (most made at a public meeting in Watford, Jan 1, 1969; see https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HGl9tzMNtpE):

"... many people at the time were very disturbed [by Hanratty's death sentence], and a large number of Members of Parliament urged the Home Secretary to recommend clemency." (this from the man introducing the A6 committee to the audience. Anybody know who he was?)

“He [JH] went to prison, I believe it was three times, for car thieving.” All the time it was for stealing cars? “Stealing cars, yes.” (James Hanratty, Sr)

"... we’ve been trying for a long long time to find out who this fellow is [who was wrongly identified by Storie]. We don’t know who he is. There’s a rumour that he’s a Spanish sailor. Lucky for him that he’s a Spanish sailor, because if he wasn’t a Spanish sailor, and if he hadn’t got an alibi, if he couldn’t remember where he was a month ago, he’d probably have been charged with the murder, he’d probably have been hung." (Paul Foot)

“Hanratty was the only cockney on the parade ..." (Jean Justice)

"The other fellow [Blackhall] says, ‘Definitely wasn’t Hanratty.’" (Foot)

"Another fellow going to work, bit of a fly boy, fellow called John Trower down in the East End. He’s, ah, easy with the police, you know, likes to keep in with the police, that kind of thing. ... he looks around, a car shoots by at 30 miles per hour. Now I don’t know if you’ve ever tried to identify a driver of a car going past you at 30 miles per hour at seven o’clock in the morning, and if you’ve tried it, well, it’s extremely difficult." (Foot; Trower testified at trial that the car was doing only 20mph)

Hanratty "wandered around looking for Tarlton or Talbot Road, where a previous prisoner friend of Hanratty was believed to live." (Foot; JH told Kleinman he was looking for Talbot or Carlton Road)

"Well, they [the police] come to a shop called Cowley’s, and there’s a man there, he says ‘Well, as a matter of fact I wasn’t here on that day, my, ah, sister, my mother, my mother-in-law was looking after the shop at the time. Perhaps you’d better go and see her.’ So they go and find the mother-in-law, who’s a very respectable lady called Mrs Dinwoodie." (Foot)

"Now they gave Mrs Dinwoodie a photograph of Hanratty and said, ‘Is this the man?’ And she said, ‘Certainly, that’s the man.’ And she signed on the back: ‘This is the man who came into my shop.’ The little girl, Barbara Ford there, they said, ‘Do you think that’s the man?’ She said, ‘Yes, that’s the man.’ Signed on the back." (Foot; in fact, Barbara Ford was not interviewed until Nov 2; She was shown some photographs but could not recognise any of them.)

"... everyone in the area knew that Gregsten and Valerie Storie used to go to that cornfield in that car. Night after night, night after night." (Foot)

The other striking thing for me was Foot's dogmatic, hectoring style of speaking. He seemed quite the opposite of the cool, dispassionate author of 'Who Killed Hanratty?'
Wow! I always said Hanratty was innocent
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  #4620  
Old 03-19-2018, 01:11 PM
NickB NickB is offline
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Foot related how he met Justice and Fox at the reburial wake and was immediately convinced by them. In 1997 he wrote: “Since that time I have been, as I still am, quite certain that Hanratty was in Rhyl when the couple were shot near Bedford 250 miles away.” Having thus decided upon the innocence of Jim, whom he described as “a young worker from south London”, Foot then saw his mission to persuade others.

However ... I admit to having fond memories of his articles and appearances on such programmes as Any Questions, when his firm beliefs were delivered with good quality humour. And on the delusional scale he is no match for Woffinden. In that same 1997 article (a review of Woffinden’s book) Foot described his own book and then wrote:

“Bob Woffinden, by contrast, boldly sets out a scenario which names Alphon as the murderer and explains the conspiracy which led him to the couple in the car, tracing his steps exactly, both in the run-up to the crime and the aftermath. The scenario is tempting, but far from conclusive.”

When Foot died, Michael Hanratty described how he had comforted him when Hanratty senior was dying: “He sat with me for a week, every evening, from work, till he died.”
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p9M_J7qZRgE

Foot’s gravestone, opposite Karl Marx’s memorial in Highgate contains a quote from Shelley’s poem, The Mask of Anarchy.
https://ethicalmartini.files.wordpre...0/dscn0914.jpg
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