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Go Back   Casebook Forums > Ripper Discussions > Witnesses

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  #41  
Old 11-13-2017, 06:09 PM
etenguy etenguy is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael W Richards View Post
I think the bayonet was suggested because it may have been broader, studier and double edged. Many bayonets of the period were.
My reading of the evidence is that it is insufficient to conclude a bayonet was used in the stabbing of Martha Tabram.

The soldier as murderer conclusion, while possible, is also uncertain. The only evidence is that one (might I suggest unreliable) witness states Martha was with a soldier much earlier that night and a policeman who challenged a soldier close to the murder scene was told he was waiting for a chum who had gone with a girl. This soldier was early to mid 20s. Describing Martha Tabram as a girl might have been a stretch.

Whether Martha had been drinking with Pearly poll and soldiers earlier or not, and whether Martha had entertained a soldier's friend during the evening, or not. There is no evidence either was the killer.

I am more convinced by Abby's argument that this was an early murder of the ripper, for the reasons she has provided. It would fit with the escalation and refinement of technique and MO as the ripper murders progressed.
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  #42  
Old Yesterday, 09:51 PM
Tom_Wescott Tom_Wescott is offline
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Originally Posted by Batman View Post
The early morning Tabram was murdered, a patrolling beat officer, PC Thomas Barrett, questioned a grenadier loitering nearby, who replied that he was waiting for a friend.

Killeen said that a wound on her sternum appeared to have been inflicted by a dagger or bayonet.

Pearly Poll said Tabram was drinking with two soldiers and herself.

It seems thatís three corroborating accounts of a military connect.

PC Barrett
Dr. Killeen
Pearly Poll

How can all three be coincidentally mistaken/lying at the same time?
Barrett's speaking with a soldier has no direct bearing on the murder of Tabram at all, Killeen did not offer a bayonet as a likely murder weapon, and Pearly Poll's story doesn't hold up at all to scrutiny.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott
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  #43  
Old Today, 07:04 AM
Abby Normal Abby Normal is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by etenguy View Post
My reading of the evidence is that it is insufficient to conclude a bayonet was used in the stabbing of Martha Tabram.

The soldier as murderer conclusion, while possible, is also uncertain. The only evidence is that one (might I suggest unreliable) witness states Martha was with a soldier much earlier that night and a policeman who challenged a soldier close to the murder scene was told he was waiting for a chum who had gone with a girl. This soldier was early to mid 20s. Describing Martha Tabram as a girl might have been a stretch.

Whether Martha had been drinking with Pearly poll and soldiers earlier or not, and whether Martha had entertained a soldier's friend during the evening, or not. There is no evidence either was the killer.

I am more convinced by Abby's argument that this was an early murder of the ripper, for the reasons she has provided. It would fit with the escalation and refinement of technique and MO as the ripper murders progressed.
Thanks eten, however, it still dosnt rule out a "soldier". the soldier could have been the ripper. I'm about 50/50 on whether it was a soldier/ripper or just the ripper (not a soldier) who came upon her after her fun with the soldiers, indeed if she even was with soldiers that night.

and fyi-I'm a dude
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  #44  
Old Today, 07:04 AM
Abby Normal Abby Normal is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom_Wescott View Post
Barrett's speaking with a soldier has no direct bearing on the murder of Tabram at all, Killeen did not offer a bayonet as a likely murder weapon, and Pearly Poll's story doesn't hold up at all to scrutiny.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott
Hi Tom
good to see you again : )
__________________
"Is all that we see or seem
but a dream within a dream?"

-Edgar Allan Poe


"...the man and the peaked cap he is said to have worn
quite tallies with the descriptions I got of him."

-Frederick G. Abberline
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  #45  
Old Today, 09:04 AM
Paddy Paddy is offline
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Default Published: Saturday 09 October 1869 Newspaper: Globe

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