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-   -   A Brothel in Cardiff (http://forum.casebook.org/showthread.php?t=9536)

miss marple 03-25-2016 01:12 AM

A Brothel in Cardiff
 
I have been looking at Brothels in Cardiff.The city seems to have been a hotbed of vice, drunkeness, disorderly conduct etc and a large Irish population. Bute St was quite notorious.

I was going to list various brothels, but I am focussing on one in particular, which got me quite intrigued, another strange coincidence in the saga of Mary Kelly.
One of the Census entries about Welsh Mary's was the family at 19 Homfrey St Cardiff.1881 Father John Kelly 55 gen labourer mother Margaret 57 both born Ireland. Helen daug 24, John 19 son and boarders. Mary Ann Kelly age 16 no occupation? is living with them.
On December 8th 1883 Mary Davies, a woman, well known to the police was charged with keeping a house of ill fame at 1 Homfray St. She lived in a house opposite where she keep a close eye on the brothel. She was described by the police as a very acute woman. The whole one of one side of Homfrey st were brothels. Davies was sentenced to six months with hard labour.
Coincidence or what? Is this part of the fabric by which MK weaves her backstory?

Miss Marple

GUT 03-25-2016 01:28 AM

And Davies???

miss marple 03-25-2016 02:24 AM

I dont think MK was Davies, the timeline does not fit but MK may have worked for her and 'borrowed' the name. The Davies name is too much of a coincidence. MK does not have the profile or success to be a brothel keeper. They were hard women who made serious money.

Miss Marple

GUT 03-25-2016 02:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by miss marple (Post 374553)
I dont think MK was Davies, the timeline does not fit but MK may have worked for her and 'borrowed' the name. The Davies name is too much of a coincidence. MK does not have the profile or success to be a brothel keeper. They were hard women who made serious money.

Miss Marple

Maybe, just maybe, the brothel keeper was a relative of the husband. That of course is IF there was any truth in the story.

miss marple 03-25-2016 02:44 AM

Yes Gut, that is another possiblity. I am researching this Mary D. If she had a relative who died in an explosion that would be gold dust. MK does not need to be married to him[ as there is no record] she just needs to have a connection with the story eg know about it.
As there are hundreds of davies it won't be easy!

Miss Marple

GUT 03-25-2016 03:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by miss marple (Post 374555)
Yes Gut, that is another possiblity. I am researching this Mary D. If she had a relative who died in an explosion that would be gold dust. MK does not need to be married to him[ as there is no record] she just needs to have a connection with the story eg know about it.
As there are hundreds of davies it won't be easy!

Miss Marple

I admire the work you, and a few others have one.

My genealogical research has mainly related to family history, where I am working from a known person, what you do seems to me a bit like looking for a needle in a haystack. Trying t find a person who loosly fits a story.

And I agree they need not be legally married.

miss marple 03-25-2016 04:10 AM

It is looking for a needle in a haystack. My approach is looking to see what is plausible in her story [ so far most of it is] and just hoping some connections may start to make sense. MK may not have been her real name but if her story is more or less true give or take a few porkies, a pattern may immerge.

Miss Marple

Elamarna 03-25-2016 04:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by miss marple (Post 374553)
I dont think MK was Davies, the timeline does not fit but MK may have worked for her and 'borrowed' the name. The Davies name is too much of a coincidence. MK does not have the profile or success to be a brothel keeper. They were hard women who made serious money.

Miss Marple

Hi Miss Marple,

The Davies name was/is very common in Wales, you say so yourself:

As there are hundreds of davies it won't be easy!


Therefore I do not see that it is "too much of a coincidence" at all.

However, I really admire the research, do keep at it, something may turn up, which would give the much needed link to the woman in Millers Court

regards

Steve

Wickerman 03-25-2016 04:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by miss marple (Post 374562)
It is looking for a needle in a haystack. My approach is looking to see what is plausible in her story [ so far most of it is] and just hoping some connections may start to make sense. MK may not have been her real name but if her story is more or less true give or take a few porkies, a pattern may immerge.

Miss Marple

You didn't mention if this Mary Davies had a son, or a male relative?, of approximately the same age as Mary Kelly.

MrBarnett 03-25-2016 04:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by miss marple (Post 374551)
I have been looking at Brothels in Cardiff.The city seems to have been a hotbed of vice, drunkeness, disorderly conduct etc and a large Irish population. Bute St was quite notorious.

I was going to list various brothels, but I am focussing on one in particular, which got me quite intrigued, another strange coincidence in the saga of Mary Kelly.
One of the Census entries about Welsh Mary's was the family at 19 Homfrey St Cardiff.1881 Father John Kelly 55 gen labourer mother Margaret 57 both born Ireland. Helen daug 24, John 19 son and boarders. Mary Ann Kelly age 16 no occupation? is living with them.
On December 8th 1883 Mary Davies, a woman, well known to the police was charged with keeping a house of ill fame at 1 Homfray St. She lived in a house opposite where she keep a close eye on the brothel. She was described by the police as a very acute woman. The whole one of one side of Homfrey st were brothels. Davies was sentenced to six months with hard labour.
Coincidence or what? Is this part of the fabric by which MK weaves her backstory?

Miss Marple

Hi Miss Marple,

This one was born in Cardiff, though. The family were at are at the same address in 1871, and Mary is again shown as being born in Cardiff, although her age is given as 4. The father is a coal ????. Also at no. 19 is a family named Flynn. The head, Timothy is employed at an iron works and two doors away is a family named McCarthy Coincidences? I would have thought so.

In 1885 a woman named Mary Barnett was convicted of running a brothel in Davis Street, Cardiff.

More coincidences than you can shake a stick at.

Gary


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