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View Full Version : Episode #49- Mary Pearcey & 'Jill the Ripper' discussion thread


jmenges
02-16-2010, 09:30 AM
Episode #49 of Rippercast is online now.

Mary Pearcey and 'Jill the Ripper'

http://www.casebook.org/podcast/listen.html?id=97

With special guests Sarah Beth Hopton, Martin Fido and Robert McLaughlin.

Available to stream or download FREE via the Ripper Podcast link on the sidebar, or via the iTunes Music Store's podcast section.

Thanks to Sarah, Martin and Robert for participating in this very interesting episode.

And thanks also to all who listen!

:operator:

JM

kimmy_lyn
02-20-2010, 10:40 PM
Hi Jonathon,
wanted to say how happy i am that the show is back on! Thank you for taking the time to do it!! Its great to listen to at work!

was wondering how far from whitechapel this murder occurred?

jmenges
02-20-2010, 11:58 PM
Thanks kimmy_lyn,



Roughly, the crime scenes of Mary Pearcey:
http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2009-2/1334619/MaryPearceyCrimeLocations.jpg

Without really looking into it, so the locations might be a bit off.

Distance to Whitechapel:
http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2009-2/1334619/MaryPearceydistance.jpg


Welcome to Casebook,

JM

Stephen Thomas
02-21-2010, 12:34 AM
Nice try JM but you are totally wrong.

Where on earth did you get all this from?

It all happened in Kentish Town.

Not West Hampstead, South Hampstead, Swiss Cottage or St Johns Wood.

Come in Colin.

jmenges
02-21-2010, 01:03 AM
Someone can please correct me if I am wrong.

JM

jmenges
02-21-2010, 01:59 AM
From her trial:

SOMERLEA MACDONALD . I reside at Belsize Park, Hampstead—I am a clerk—on 24th October I was passing along Crossfield Road, Hampstead, about 7.10 p. m.; it was very dark—I noticed something lying by the side of the road—a house was being built there—it was a woman lying with her face covered—her face was across the path towards the road—I passed on, but walked back—I found the body still in the same position—in consequence of what I saw I went to Swiss Cottage Railway Station to find a policeman

THOMAS WRIGHT (Inspector S). On Friday evening, 24th October, about eight o'clock, I was on duty at Hampstead Police-station; I received a communication from a constable, in consequence of which I went to Crossfield Road, and there found the dead body of a woman lying on the pathway

It appears as though I may have been a block off...

http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2009-2/1334619/Phoebe.jpg

Again, if I am missing something here (entirely possible), please post an accurate map.


JM

Stephen Thomas
02-21-2010, 02:04 AM
Someone can please correct me if I am wrong.

JM

I just did, JM.

Does Pearcey's house appear on your map? No.

Does her victims' house appear on your map? No.

So you're doing something wrong, obviously.

I've lived in this area for 40 years

And I know what I'm talking about

jmenges
02-21-2010, 02:07 AM
Then, as I've said, correct me, Stephen. Which means post an accurate map.

Thanks.

JM

jmenges
02-21-2010, 02:43 AM
Does her victims' house appear on your map? No.



Here is where I believe the location of the home of Frank and Phoebe Hogg is. 141 Prince of Wales Road. And yes, I failed to include it on my first map since no crime was committed there.

http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2009-2/1334619/PhoebeHouse.jpg


JM

sbhopton
02-21-2010, 03:25 AM
Here is a link you can follow to retrace the locations key and relevant to Mary Pearcey's crimes. (Sorry it's so long; bitly wouldn't work with this link)

http://maps.google.com/maps?f=d&source=s_d&saddr=Ivor+St,+London+NW1,+United+Kingdom&daddr=141+Prince+of+Wales+Road+to:Crossfield+Rd,+L ondon+NW3,+UK+to:34+Hamilton+Terrace+to:Finchley+R d,+London,+United+Kingdom&hl=en&geocode=FS96EgMd-dz9_yn58FqTHRt2SDHzC3kJUaTz0g%3BFQCHEgMdAKz9_ylthk hX5Rp2SDGrVfDvifQ1Uw%3B%3BFeM_EgMdKUn9_ymJWIkdpRp2 SDEM3MsPshYeAg%3BFQfDEgMdzv78_yl9QRT0fRB2SDFndz-LxX24Tw&mra=ls&sll=51.545285,-0.16827&sspn=0.052203,0.148144&ie=UTF8&ll=51.544413,-0.168228&spn=0.052204,0.148144&z=13

Of importance:

No. 5 Belsize Park Rd (Not included on map) = residence of Somerlea Macdonald, according to census records.

Swiss Cottage Railway Station (Not included in map) = this is where Somerlea went to to get help. He found and brought back to Crossfield Road Sergeant Arthur Gardner (S Division).

Crossfield Road = Where Phoebe Hogg's body was found. The exact location is not mentioned (to my knowledge) in the records. Her body was dumped on a section of road partitioned off from the main street by an iron gate. The road was being developed.

Finchley Road = Where Tiggie (baby Hogg) was found under a nettle bush. This was also an undeveloped area, something like a field or heath but was described in court records as simply a "dump site."

No. 2 Priory Street = (Now Ivor Street) Mary Pearcey's home and site of the alleged murders.

141 Prince of Wales Road = Where Frank Hogg, his sister Clara, his mother, Maria, and his wife and baby lived alongside another lodger, perhaps the owner of the flat.

No. 34 Hamilton Terrace = Where the pram was found by a constable. It was leaning against the gate. The cook at No. 34 noticed it on her way out to run errands.

There are, of course, countless other points of interest one might include in such a map including the police stations, the Hampstead mortuary, the coroner's court, the Old Bailey, Mary Pearcey's various lodgings, her childhood homes etc. And, I believe I am correct in saying (and backing up JM) that while the murder itself took place in Kentish Town, the points of interest surrounding the story include parts of Kentish Town, Camden, Hampstead and the city of London.

I hope this is helpful. ~ SBH

jmenges
02-21-2010, 04:08 AM
No. 2 Priory Street = (Now Ivor Street) Mary Pearcey's home and site of the alleged murders.



I thank you for the info Sarah, as you have actually been to the scenes, and I stand corrected about the location of Pearcey's house. I assumed that Priory Rd and Priory Terrace turned into Priory St back then after it crossed Belsize Road. A bit west of the location of Ivor.

Nice to know that, as I said in my initial post, my "rough..without really looking into it" map is almost correct, rather than "totally wrong".


JM

kimmy_lyn
02-21-2010, 04:10 AM
thanks to you guys for posting the maps!

Stephen Thomas
02-21-2010, 01:45 PM
Nice to know that, as I said in my initial post, my "rough..without really looking into it" map is almost correct, rather than "totally wrong".


JM

Sincere apologies, Jon.

My replies were disrespectful to your good self.

But I really do know what's what on his one.

I live here and know all those streets.

And I pass by the Pearcey murder house most every day and was just surprised that you were so wrong as to where it is.

DirectorDave
02-23-2010, 03:59 PM
Thankyou Jon,

It is great to have a new episode.....Sarah, Martin and Robert were really great and gave honest and valued opinions.

I have said before these podcast's will be used by Ripperologists in years to come as much as any Memorandi (sp?) or Marginalia.

Many thanks for this great free service.

jmenges
02-27-2010, 06:17 PM
We appreciate any corrections from our guests and listeners since we often conduct these episodes with little or no notes and little or no preparation. :1tongue:

This correction comes from Sarah Beth Hopton:

It has to do with the extremely confusing genealogy.

Mary's father was James Whitford Wheeler. Jame's father's name was Thomas Wheeler. The man who killed Edward Anstee (and was accused of being Mary's father) was Thomas Wheeler (though of no relation, so far). I continued to say throughout the podcast that Mary's father's name was Thomas Wheeler. It isn't. It's James. Her grandfather's name was Thomas Wheeler, though this wasn't the same Thomas Wheeler that murdered E. Anstee. All the other information about him is correct: his birth place and what he died from and that he was a constable.

Thanks, Sarah!

:operator:

JM

Debra A
02-28-2010, 02:21 AM
An excellent podcast, I'm looking forward to Sarah's book on the case.

sbhopton
02-28-2010, 03:57 AM
Thank you Debra. I'm looking forward to finishing it and having it published. :)

snoo
04-27-2010, 07:33 AM
It was delightful to listen to Sarah's capable, subtle analysis of her subject. I'm looking forward to the book.